crime in Oz

[AndreaL]

Fair point Bronwyn, Donny and others

Let me just spill things out as I would in normal conversation and if I offend, I sincerely apologise.

Everyone here has made valid points and they have been their experiences..............my frustration results from a few comments that have been made, Johnno mentioning rose tinted glasses and that people need to get out more and yours (Donny) that there are some people here who don't seem to realise what is going on.........................these are simply not fair, everyone is giving their honest experience, as you have asked.........................but I'm feeling that anyone who says other than Johnno is being discounted and there is a suggestion that they are either blind or don't get out much................perhaps that is why I've been getting frustrated.

However, I get over things quickly and what is more important to me is to make sure that members DO feel welcome enough to ask any question they might want and not worry about stepping on toes.......................that is not what we are about Donny, but you will get a variety of opinions.......lol

One last thing and this will seem strange to anyone not living in Australia...................Australia is huge, I am about 4000km or more from Perth, and for some reason ( I'm not sure why) there seems to be a great divide between WA and the Eastern states.

When I lived in WA, obviously the news was mostly about WA and now I'm over in the Eastern states, we don't really hear much about WA................it is almost as if there are two different countries here in Australia..........( has anyone else experienced or felt like this?)

Donny, reading between the lines, I get that you have some very personal reasons for asking what you have and what you still want to ask.

Just go ahead and ask...........one thing I am certain of is that the members here will give you as objective an opinion as they possibly can.

We won't always agree on everything, but we have a good mix of members, with a huge variety of experiences, all of which are valid.

These questions are important to you Donny, so go ahead, everyone's voice counts here.

[Donnyvcpt]

Thanks Andrea, actually the reasons for me asking is not as personal as you may think. Being a tradie it is very likely that I would work outside normal working hours so my concern and the reason for me trying to get as much info out of this as possible lies with my wife and daughter. If I'm forced to work night shift, I want to feel confident that they are safe at home. It's as simple as that really.

As for the other concern I mentioned, the reason why I'm 2 minded about mentioning it is because it's more of a world wide issue that one that's limited to Australia specifically. Here it goes anyway, the youth. Having watched that video clip of how they attacked people at a wedding for no reason made my blood boil. Then I stumbled on a news report on how two 14 year old boys beat and stabbed a 64 year old lady. It just seems as though they are the biggest offenders over there in Australia.

I know this is a global issue, but this seems ridiculous.

[Johnno]

Donnyvcpt asked a simple question "I was wondering if any of you have been or know of someone who has been a victim to crime in Oz? And also what makes you classify these areas as rough?" I answer it truthfully with images and examples of what I've experienced, simply to back up my answer.

Did I say it's worse than SA....NO! Did I say people are raped and murdered in the streets....NO! Was I honest in what I have personally experienced, my friends, family and works colleagues have experienced.....YES! Any idiot can Google crime stats and look at pages of spreadsheets but that's not what Donny was asking for. He asked a specific question and I answered it as best and as honestly as I can. If that has offended people then I apologise for being honest.

I was extremely disappointed when a few weeks after arriving in Oz our privacy was invaded (no not murdered or raped) but my wallet and brand new digital camera with all our 2001 Easter weekend photos was stolen from my car in my carport. We were looking so forward to emailing the pics to family and friends in SA. The same experience can be said fr for our friends who arrived a few months ago (Dec last year) and last weekend had very expensive bicycles stolen. This was not some kid looking for a cheap ride home! CCTV shows two men entering the secure underground basement of the apartment, taking 10mins to cut through a chain and then disappearing out through a fire exit.

This morning when driving to work I saw another of those mobile police signs (it was not there yesterday) warning about increased activity in house break-ins!! I'm not imagining it, I saw it and when I pop out for lunch a bit later I will take a photo to prove it. In the last 10 weeks we have had three break-ins at our branch offices in Brisbane (twice) and Adelaide. Again I post pics and yet people say that I won't let go because I cannot get people to agree with me. I say nonsense, I come in contact with a lot of people in business and socially and I get to travel around Aus a lot...maybe therein lies the diffs?

PS! Donnyvcpt, the www is full of opinions and info. Here's a site that I stumbled across....http://melbournism.com/what-is-melbournes-worst-suburb/comment-page-1/#comments These views would be of people from the Melbourne area....makes for interesting reading

Edited April 16, 2014 by Johnno

[HansaPlease]

PS! Donnyvcpt, the www is full of opinions and info. Here's a site that I stumbled across....http://melbournism.com/what-is-melbournes-worst-suburb/comment-page-1/#comments These views would be of people from the Melbourne area....makes for interesting reading

And herein lies the problem with the Interwebz. For every sensible comment you have to sift through 5 comments from trolls. Looking at that, it's easy for me to point out (to en extent) who's talking rubbish and who's being facetious- I mean come on - Brighton, Caulffield, etc, some of the worst suburbs in Melbourne? The people who pay millions to live there would probably disagree. I can see how somebody who's new to Melbourne would read that and wonder whether they've landed in a ghetto!

Not having a go at you Johno, just pointing out how inaccurate the net can be.

[Mel-B]

OK. Wow. Quite a read!

I appreciate everyone's views and responses. Makes it real. I am not put off going to Melbourne at all. It is good to be realistic about my expectations though.

People are people. Living on a island with 100 people you will still have crime. I really think (HOPE) it will an upgrade for us.

We live across from a park in Pretoria and can't use it. There are always people sleeping and drinking there. It is a good neighborhood though. We were burgled while we slept while on holiday (could have been worse), we were knocked out with some sort of smoke/gas? Not sure. Police didn't really get into it or seem to care. Our neighbour was killed with a hammer 5 years ago and the report stated NATURAL CAUSES due to him dying of a heart attack while being hit on the head repeatedly. Does that want to make you laugh or cry? NATURAL? wow. We moved soon after that. New home we moved into the neighbor also was murdered by his gardener. Yikes.

Then we have maybe 10 people we know closely who have been shot, burgled at home, tied up, beaten up at home, hijacked, etc etc. This is not normal?? 2 weeks ago a man walked around our complex with an AXE. 4 o clock during the afternoon. The kids were playing outside. He eventually stole some tools after breaking into a garage. Could have been worse I guess. But def. no way to raise children.

Surely Oz should offer better odds? That is what I'm hoping for...

[HansaPlease]

Does Oz have better odds? Absolutely without a doubt, far better. No matter what has been said in this thread, that is one thing you can count on.

[chzaau]

Oz does have better odds as long as you don't live in an indigenous community where the crime rate is out of control.

[AndreaL]

Thanks Andrea, actually the reasons for me asking is not as personal as you may think. Being a tradie it is very likely that I would work outside normal working hours so my concern and the reason for me trying to get as much info out of this as possible lies with my wife and daughter. If I'm forced to work night shift, I want to feel confident that they are safe at home. It's as simple as that really.

As for the other concern I mentioned, the reason why I'm 2 minded about mentioning it is because it's more of a world wide issue that one that's limited to Australia specifically. Here it goes anyway, the youth. Having watched that video clip of how they attacked people at a wedding for no reason made my blood boil. Then I stumbled on a news report on how two 14 year old boys beat and stabbed a 64 year old lady. It just seems as though they are the biggest offenders over there in Australia.

I know this is a global issue, but this seems ridiculous.

Donny, my hubby is an electrician and when we first landed in Perth he worked in compressor factory in Welshpool. I also did nightfill at the local Woolies to make ends meet and sometimes would come home at midnight.

I always felt pretty safe, I did have a bit of trouble from an Indigenous family 2 doors up, but through time got to know the man of the house and the grandmother and always made a point of saying hello when I passed and things seemed fine from then.

We then moved to Albany and hubby worked some nightshifts and I never ever felt unsafe or had any problems, I knew my neighbours by name and the houses were pretty close so I could probably have shouted them if I had any problems.

We then moved to Queensland, a little mining town, hubby works shifts and it is such a lovely community.............I am sitting out on my back patio with a cider in my pj's and in 5 years have never had a jot of trouble.

Look, I never have my doors locked, but if I lived in a city, i would...........if you take reasonable precautions, i.e. the house is locked and you have a well lit front path with those motion lights, I don't think you will have any problems.

But yes, there is always that scum element in every country, the scammers, the thieves, the people who just take what they want.............no denying that and you do have to realise that.

I lived in a suburb of Alberton almost 11 years ago and had to have my neighbours number on speed dial on my phone, we had a signal that I would ring 3 times if something was wrong, i had a few thefts etc and was on my own while hubby contracted in Namibia.

I never slept properly then and had a baseball bat under the bed, but how would I have defended myself with that I don't know. We then spent 3 years in the south of Namibia and I felt safe there although I believe there is a fair bit of crime up North..................worrying about safety and crime takes up so little of my time now...........each time I have been silly and left the keys in the car or my wallet at a check out I have been very lucky.

[AndreaL]

This is an interesting site, it seems it is just for Queensland, but if you live in Queensland, type in your address and it will show crimes around you http://www.crimemap.info/

[OubaasDik]

I suppose it's appropriate that this thread resurrected over Easter.

I'm not really sure just how meaningful those warning signs are. Here in Canberra, there are similar signs warning people about the evils of crossing red traffic lights. Do people do it? Yes, they do. Do I wish they would get a cramp in the fundament? Assuredly. Is it a huge problem? Not really, it usually occurs when people are trying to turn right across traffic, and "just another one who's tired of waiting" tries to sneak over.

Edited April 22, 2014 by OubaasDik

[Mikej]

Do I wish they would get a cramp in the fundament? Assuredly.

I have no idea what the "fundament" is but it sounds funny.

[OubaasDik]

I have no idea what the "fundament" is but it sounds funny.

Since you expressed an interest - try http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/fundament?s=t

[Mikej]

Since you expressed an interest - try http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/fundament?s=t

I am overjoyed at discovering another description for this most important anatomical feature.

[Bronwyn&Co]

This is an interesting site, it seems it is just for Queensland, but if you live in Queensland, type in your address and it will show crimes around you http://www.crimemap.info/

Thanks Andrea, very interesting. It seems about 1/4 of my neighbors have been burgled in the past few years. The stats look a lot higher in the city, probably due to lots more people.

I was interested to see the theft of my friends' cars is on there with the exact date, so it seems accurate!

Edited to add...loving this! Seems there was a homicide and arson 4 doors down from our old house. And drug offences ALL over the area. I might be a bit more careful, yikes!

Edited April 22, 2014 by Bronwyn&Co

[Johnno]

Please don't shoot the messenger!

http://www.news.com.au/national/victoria/police-refuse-car-crime-reports-over-the-phone/story-fnii5sms-1226897595668

Police refuse car crime reports over the phone

POLICE officers have been ­ordered not to take reports of thefts from motor vehicles over the phone and instead ­demand victims drive their ­vehicles to stations.

The move has seen the force accused of trying to manipulate crime statistics by making it difficult to report skyrocketing offences.

But Victoria Police claims the insistence victims bring in their cars for forensic tests will better help catch criminals.

The move was launched last month in Frankston, Mornington and Knox without the backing of some officers.

“This instruction is a blatant and obvious attempt to artificially drive down crime reporting by making it much more difficult to report crime,” one senior officer from Mornington said.

“This sets a dangerous precedent. What happens if ­reports of assaults go up in the same manner?

“Although thefts from motor vehicles stats will go down, actual crimes may rise because vehicles are not being processed and offenders are not being caught.”

The email by Superintendent Neil Paterson to all officers in the Southern Metropolitan Region Division 4 - which includes Mornington and Frankston - was sent on March 31.

“Given our extremely high offending rate around Theft from Motor Vehicle at present ... I am of the view that reports for TFMV must be taken in person rather than received via telephone,” it states.

“This in effect means that NO telephone reporting for this offence ... is to occur until further notice.”

Secretary of the Police ­Association Victoria, Ron ­Iddles, said the policy was flawed. “If the only reason this edict has gone out is for members to have a better chance of apprehending offenders, it is severely flawed,” he said.

“There is a much better chance if the car is examined at the scene — rather than asking a victim to ruin any potential forensic evidence by driving it to a police station.”

Victoria Police spokes­woman Sergeant Jo Stafford said change would “maximise the opportunity to identify ­offenders” by taking forensic evidence from the vehicles as soon as possible.

“We absolutely reject that the process is designed to inconvenience victims, rather it is aimed at identifying the ­offender and giving the victim resolution to the crime as soon as possible, while also preventing others from becoming ­victims of crime.”

Edited April 27, 2014 by Johnno

[Johnno]

This is an interesting site, it seems it is just for Queensland, but if you live in Queensland, type in your address and it will show crimes around you http://www.crimemap.info/

wOW, what a concise database! I did a quick "crime tour" of Brisbane and it would appear that in many areas the residents or home owners have had the need to report a crime of some sort. I took this "snap shot" of just a few streets in Ashgrove and it would seem that most (more than half) the households have had reason to report a crime to the authorities.

[patrice]

evidently a very emotive question >

We all have different experiences - but .... On a balance of probabilities, I believe one has a much lower risk of being affected by crime in OZ - that is a fact, and a key reason why we stayed here.

Also, while there is crime here in OZ, it does not seem to take the same violent theme as in ZAR. In my humble opinion, for example, it seems that the norm in ZAR is that 'home invasions' seems to follow a similar theme - the men are murdered and the women are raped - this is not the case in OZ

I would question the comparison of 'stats', based on my understanding that all crime is actually reported in OZ, and does not get 'lost' in the system or hidden as in other countries. This statistical change of support makes comparison meaningless. As an example I note that here in OZ a pub fight is news worthy and makes the paper, yet murders and rapes do not seem news worthy in other countries.

my 2c........

[Johnno]

evidently a very emotive question >

We all have different experiences - but .... On a balance of probabilities, I believe one has a much lower risk of being affected by crime in OZ - that is a fact, and a key reason why we stayed here.

Also, while there is crime here in OZ, it does not seem to take the same violent theme as in ZAR. In my humble opinion, for example, it seems that the norm in ZAR is that 'home invasions' seems to follow a similar theme - the men are murdered and the women are raped - this is not the case in OZ

I would question the comparison of 'stats', based on my understanding that all crime is actually reported in OZ, and does not get 'lost' in the system or hidden as in other countries. This statistical change of support makes comparison meaningless. As an example I note that here in OZ a pub fight is news worthy and makes the paper, yet murders and rapes do not seem news worthy in other countries.

my 2c........

patrice, you are spot on, 100% correct. SA is the world title holder for crime, especially violent crime and there's certainly no dispute there and definitely no disagreement from me. In fact it's probably the reason why we are virtually neighbours in Oz

BUT this is not a comparison between crime in SA and Oz (cross threading here with the other thread of crime in Oz) it's about our own personal views of crime in Oz and some of the things that we dislike about Oz.

I'm not complaining non-stop about Oz and it's sad that some people see it as negative beat up on Oz and then ask why one does not return to SA simply because we admit to some personal dislikes of things like hooning, drunken brawls and silly "means tested" taxes! I suppose what really peeves me off is the new arrivals who choose not to see any of the less desirable "goings-on" in Aus and then when they are faced with something they say "well at least no one was murdered or raped" which according to them is standard procedure in SA.

[Nev]

I have been following this post and johnno is exhibiting classic symptoms of being an internet troll,

He joins threads and posts stuff that by now he knows is going to get people riled up, then posts a pic of /popcorn when the drama starts, tells everyone he wont be giving any more advice and a few posts later is back with a article highlighted with words like "Given our extremely high offending rate around Theft from Motor Vehicle at present".

Having fun mate?

[RYLC]

Nev I think it's called "having the last word" or perhaps being a right fighter for those who have ever watched Dr Phil.

[Donnyvcpt]

I'm sorry guys, but I can't understand why you guys feel the need to attack johno every time he posts something on this thread. When he shared personal experience, he was called a liar, now he's sharing news articles and a snapshot of a page that Andrea suggested we have a look at and you guys are having another go at him.

Why does it seem as though people just don't like hearing about these things? Like patrice said "we all have different experiences". Perhaps Johno has just experienced more than others so he has something to add to this thread.

If you guys wanna have a go at each other then maybe you should pm each other, but this isn't the place for that. I think the posts are quite relevant to this thread so why we getting bent out of shape?

Edited April 28, 2014 by Donnyvcpt

[RYLC]

From a post on another thread, here is why:

Johnno wants the honest truth and what is the truth? Ah I feel the old philosopher in me stirring.

"How was the meal?"

"Well to be "HONEST" there was a little too much salt in the sauce. However if you want the whole truth the meat was juicy and tender with the fat nicely crisped and the desert was heavenly. And in addition to that the company was warm and friendly and we had a great evening"

PS. Donnyvcpt, when are you moving over? Sooner the better to see for yourself...

[AndreaL]

Donny

I think, taken along with what was posted in the other thread, that more people disagree than agree with Johnno's perceptions.............and for me it is the little digs about people being fools or refusing to see the truth because they don't agree with him................as long as you are sensible and remember that it is only peoples opinions on here and do your own research and make your own decisions.......the rest will sort itself out.

Just remember that the tiniest of crimes tend to get reported here, i.e. someone stole my shoes off the stoep..................so it is all about context.

There are hoons in both countries, there are drugs in both countries, there is crime in both countries................but I can tell you hand on heart that I have never felt unsafe here, and sleep better here than I ever did in RSA, simply because there is less chance of something bad happening to me............I can put up with rude youth etc (having lived many years in the UK) and other annoying petty crimes like egging houses, as long as I know that I am unlikely to be among the 250 murders per year, in a population of around 23 million.

[Bronwyn&Co]

I have to agree with Donny. Johnno is far from trolling. Trolls join forums with a fake persona, cause trouble and then move on.

I may be way off, but based on some assistance I received from Johnno via PM on another Topic, this is not the case at all.

It is frustrating to see people hell-bent on wrongly stating that Australia is Utopia. That causes a person to try and prove their point that it's just a normal country with more & more stats. This effort ends up making the place look worse than it is.

Some people reading these conversations may come away with the idea that the streets are filled with drugged-up hoons. That isn't the case. But on the other hand it's silly to leave your car unlocked with your laptop on the passenger seat.

This is something that really gets my back up on here. If a viewpoint is unpopular, the person receives personal insults, at which time they get upset and leave the forum. So we just bully people until they agree with us or leave?? It's happened quite a few times.

[Donovan83]

Can always rely on Johnno to bring us the bad news about Australia.