crime in Oz

[Johnno]

I'm really confused. I believe that there's been an sharp increase in crime (here in Perth). Maybe it's becasue the longer you live in an area the more people you meet, get to know, socialize and work with so I'm seeing and hearing more. I then hear from other forumites that crime is not an issue in other states. I then do some research and find statements like this.....

http://www.racq.com.au/about_us/news_and_community/news_and_media/stories/fear_of_property_crime_stalks_queensland_suburbs_top_20_home_theft_suburbs_revealed

RACQ Insurance Executive Manager Communications, Mike Sopinski, said the 2012 Home Security Index revealed one-quarter (25 per cent) of Queenslanders had experienced a home break-in and six per cent had been broken into multiple times.

that's a lot of break-ins, one in 4 homes have experienced a home burglary! Do you think this report is bulltish!

I then look at the suburb where "Fish" lives and I see a report like this....

http://mypolice.qld.gov.au/brisbanewest/2014/03/10/crime-alert-bardon-ashgrove-gap-break-enters/

Inner West Police are warning residents of Ashgrove and The Gap to firm up their security and be extra vigilant after a sharp spike in break ins yesterday.

“We are vulnerable to these highly mobile offenders who steal keys for vehicles and commit a series of ‘rip and run’ break ins as they traverse our suburbs,” said Acting Inspector Allen.

When I lived in SA I took my security quite pretty seriously and thankfully we never had a single incident at our home. I'm not saying become security nuts and build a fortress but please be mindful that crime does happen in Oz. Sure, they may only break-in and steal a few odds and ends, maybe even your car keys and then your car which are all replaceable (hopefully) but the invasion of your privacy, the inconvenience and most importantly the psychological effect on your family is not worth being a smart ass and pretending that crime does not happen, it does!

[Fish]

Johnno, my only comment has been my sense that crime is at a similar level to 13 years ago. I have made no comment saying crime is not an issue or anything like that. I have lived in Brisbane for 40+ years and have listened to family, friends and colleagues discuss the number of breaks-in they have suffered etc over this whole time....I have not seen the huge increase you have.

If you are going to reply so rudely the least you can do is accurately represent what I said. Comments like "Do you think this report is bulltish!" are childish and unnecessary.

Your report of what was said about the inner west where I live is totally irrelevant to what I said about not seeing the huge increase you have over the last 13 years. People I know had break-ins 13 years ago and have had them recently. The same police report could easily have been from a newspaper 13 years ago.

Edited April 10, 2014 by Fish

[Johnno]

Fish, don't take it personally, my comments are not intended that way. I respect that in your view you have not experienced an increase in crime in your area. My point is simply that when us Saffa's arrive her in Oz we drop our guard as we think and are often led to believe that crime will never happen. Leaving doors unlocked even when at home is probably the most common place of entry for a quick snatch and run, helping themselves to handbags, car keys, wallets etc. After 13yrs in Oz I am only now starting to make sure that when we are out the back swimming or having a few friends over for a BBQ, we lock the front door, cars and garage.

In 2004 inbeteween moves we spent a week at Sorrento Beach Resort where I experienced a break-in. I chased a burglar that ran like the wind. The security guard insisted that we search the neighbours gardens and we flushed him out but he was impossible to catch. Luckily he got himself cornered and a well executed rugby tackle brought him down. We recovered a stash of jewelry, cash and two cameras. All was returned to their owners at Sorrento Beach Resort but the thief wriggled out if the security guards grips and took off like a cat in the night. Burglar 1 Johnno 0

[AndreaL]

I think you have to look closely at the context Johnno, that is from the RACQ home security index, on one hand they are saying that 25% of QLD homes have been broken into, on the other they say that in the Queensland crime hotspot of Underwood, they get 3.95 claims per 100 insurance policies.............remember they are trying to sell you home insurance.

Do the figures relate to people insured by RACQ or all Queenslanders?

This statement is a little confusing.......

The Queensland Police Service Annual Statistical Review 2010/11 showed home break-ins across the state remained a significant problem with 24,955 homes broken into during the year. The police statistics also showed 8,781 cases of stealing from Queensland homes.

Mr Sopinski said the RACQ Insurance research showed there was a marked difference in the application of basic home security between metropolitan and regional dwellers, with 23 per cent of Brisbane householders admitting they sometimes left their home unlocked compared to 37 per cent of regional Queenslanders.

Full article here http://www.racq.com.au/about_us/news_and_community/news_and_media/stories/fear_of_property_crime_stalks_queensland_suburbs_top_20_home_theft_suburbs_revealed

Not one person here has denied that crime exists, but again, crime is very different here, stealing a pair of work boots off your patio counts as a crime...........supermarket theft is included in the theft statistics.

I live in a town of about 8000 or so people, if anything happens, we all know about it, I would say in the past 5 years we have had about 2 dozen thefts..........a packet of cigarettes off someones outside table on the front stoep, rims off cars, scooters, bikes, shoes, beers from outside fridges (this is popular at the end of year school holidays...........fridging) oh and a few post boxes and some Christmas lights, we have had one theft from a store in our little mall, where an employee going to the bank was relieved of the bag of takings..................we have had one serious event, where a man holed up in his house and then shot himself...............there have been a few people caught possessing or selling drugs, some DUI's etc, just drive past the court house on a Friday and you can see who has been naughty and the names are also published in the Mackay newspaper.

Hardly anyone locks their doors here, people feel they shouldn't have to.....................in a fair few of the petty crime cases, particularly those involving teenagers, they have been found out, either by parents or friends or the community, returned the goods, apologised and had to do yard work or wash cars to show contrition.

Honestly, it's not such a bad way to live.

If I lived elsewhere, I would most certainly lock my doors and windows, but we leave things in our open yards for months at a time, never feel fear and can walk the streets day or night without being hassled.

I've lived in Perth too, in St James............... a low socio-economic suburb with a lot of students at the Uni and foreign migrants and had one incidence of having my bag stolen..................and I am fairly certain I know who did it. I went round to all the neighbours in the street and told them, including the 'suspect'.

I was never scared to be alone, and the only thing I didn't like was an Aboriginal family where the kids would shout racist things when you walked by, but I got to know the male of the house and the gandmother and never had a problem after that.

[Johnno]

I think you have to look closely at the context Johnno, that is from the RACQ home security index, on one hand they are saying that 25% of QLD homes have been broken into, on the other they say that in the Queensland crime hotspot of Underwood, they get 3.95 claims per 100 insurance policies.............remember they are trying to sell you home insurance.

Do the figures relate to people insured by RACQ or all Queenslanders?

and that is why I asked if anyone thought the report was bulltish.....and I was told that my comments are 'childish and unnecessary'

I have family in Barrydale, South Africa where they also feel pretty relaxed about crime.99% of all crime in Barrydale precedent happens in the local township on pay day

Edited April 11, 2014 by Johnno

[Jeeper41]

Well..I lived in South Africa (Johannesburg and Durban) for 20 years..never had an incident - no mugging, no hijacking nothing. I was held up by a couple of indigenous Australians at kinfe-point in Kalgoorlie - they wanted all the cash I had. So yeah, depends what your definition of 'crime' is.

[AndreaL]

It just read a bit differently Johnno, as if you were directing the comment at Fish and challenging his veracity...............no worries though, we all risk that when we write.

You've been here long enough to know that the way things are reported here can sometimes be sensationalised..............remember bad news sells..............I forgot to add that a report was published by an academic re the impact of FIFO workers on crime in Central Queensland (my town in fact) according to the report the rape rate has doubled......................so I looked onto this and yes it was true, the rate has doubled from one to two..............of course that is still terrible, but context is everything.

I get what you are saying, and you are right to let Donny know the facts, but you think we are understating them and I (I don't know about others) think are overstating them..............the truth is somewhere in between. I didn't feel safe for one day in Alberton, South Africa, I haven't felt unsafe for one day in Australia.............................................that is not to say you should be stupid, but crime is usually an unusual and abhorrent act here, not a daily occurrence, particularly violent crime.

We don't need burglar bars for the most part, and I would wonder what was going on if I saw a house with major security, but yes, we do need to make sure our front doors are secure and well lit....................yes, there are some suburbs that have more social ills, but I still maintain that living in an upmarket suburb doesn't afford you some sort of protection against crime, most crime is a result of opportunity, but some crimes are planned, and high end crims purposely target areas where the gains are going to be greater.

A lot of the petty crime, graffiti and vandalism to property and cars, is done by young people................remember the playing field is a lot more level here, there aren't millions of people living in abject poverty, so the reasons people commit crimes are different.

Oh, I've just watched The Project.................and apparently we are the biggest nation of crims...........that is for illegal downloading of TV shows and films.

[aquagirl]

Johnno I have to agree with you crime has increased in Perth.

Of course you can't compare against South Africa but it is such a shame as we no longer feel as safe as we used to.

Most shocking is the home invasions in the last year where women have been repeated raped and their children threatened. I know of someone who has had to leave the country for fear of retaliation as she got the rapist put in jail but his family have threatened her.

Drugs and bikie gangs are one of our biggest problems here. The out of control teenage drinking is also causing many problems especially for the the police and ambulance crews. There is very little respect for authority from an increasing number of children and adults.

There have been a lot of attempted abductions of children walking to and from schools.

From what I have gathered the more up market the suburb the more security you need.

I know and Australian who has had a "rape gate" in her Pepperment Grove mansion for many years.

Edited April 11, 2014 by aquagirl

[RYLC]

From all the posts it looks like those in WA feel it most then

[Donnyvcpt]

Seems you're learning as much as I am from this topic crisplet. It's a far cry off the first response I got which was "you're kidding right!"

It's a pity that a few unruly people are able to spoil the reputation of a place. I will definitely be avoiding Perth, and to all those dying to say it, yes I know it's still 100 times better than SA, but I don't want to live where crime seems to be on the rise. I'm sure its on the rise everywhere, but clearly perth has been red flagged here.

Thanks everyone for the honest answers, it really helps those of us in the process to re-think and re-plan.

[gordonza]

From all the posts it looks like those in WA feel it most then

Doesn't WA the highest population of South Africans?

[RYLC]

Doesn't WA the highest population of South Africans?

Yip

The reply of "you're kidding right!" was based on being in comparison to RSA

Edited April 11, 2014 by Crisplet

[HansaPlease]

From all the posts it looks like those in WA feel it most then

It does seem that way. In 7 years in Melbourne it doesn't seem to me like crime has gone up, but then again I don't know the real figures because it's not an issue enough for me to take notice. We live in a peaceful suburb. The previous suburb had more issues.

The local paper's crime section certainly does report break ins and the like, but not enough to make me feel uncomfortable. It seems about the "right level" of crime to me for a first world country. Of course, Zero is always the target but if course that's impossible where humans are involved.

We lock our doors (although my wife often forgets - bloody Aussie! ) and take the usual low level precautions. Every now and again we hear about something that has happened, but other than that, we just don't think about it enough for it to be an issue in our lives.

[AndreaL]

Donny, you should be thinking more about where you are likely to find work, than avoiding Perth because of crime. If you applied the same philosophy to your life in South Africa, you wouldn't be living in C.T. you'd be living in some tiny town in the middle of nowhere, with little crime and little work.

I know plenty of people in Perth who have lived there for decades and never been touched by crime, other than a loud party or the like.

I think this is getting a little ridiculous, crime just doesn't happen because you live in a bad area (let's exclude rural indigenous areas with known levels of social problems) or not happen because you live in a good area................a lot of it is opportunity, coincidence, or plain bad luck.

According to ABS, (1995 figures) ACT has the most robbery, Perth has the most assault, ACT has the most break and enter,and motor vehicle theft.Those are reported crimes.

Of course those figures may be entirely different now

State/Territory crime rates
National crime statistics show that crime rates varied considerably between Australia's States and Territories, and that no single State had the highest crime rate for all offence categories. New South Wales had by far the highest crime rate for robbery offences, but murder and assault were more prevalent in the Northern Territory while property crimes were more prevalent in Western Australia. In contrast, crime rates in Victoria, Queensland, Tasmania and the Australian Capital Territory tended to be below national rates for most offence categories.

It is possible to speculate about some reasons for these differences. For example, large cities tend to have higher crime rates, and some States have a large proportion of their population concentrated in large cities. States also differ in their demographic, ethnic and socio-economic profiles. However, other factors such as the level of policing activity and the way police record crimes may also be important¹, as well as the differences in the proportions of victims who report the crime to the police.

Crimes recorded by police in 1995 show NT to have the highest murder rate, and assault, WA to have the highest sexual assault rate, NSW for armed robbery, NT for unlawful entry with intent, WA for motor vehicle theft, WA for other theft.

There aren't clear trends or indicators, much depends on the way crime is reported and recorded and other socio-economic indicators.

[HansaPlease]

Andrea, I agree that crime does not discriminate by area, but "generally" - chances are, you would be experiencing more of it will be in a lower socio-economic area.

[AndreaL]

Andrea, I agree that crime does not discriminate by area, but "generally" - chances are, you would be experiencing more of it will be in a lower socio-economic area.

Yes, you would, but I'm trying to illustrate that staying in an upmarket suburb in Australia does not guarantee you will not be affected by crime, or that you can't rule out a whole city because of perceived crime, and that just like South Africa, the reasons crime is committed in Australia are unique to Australia

Remember, I'm from a working class background and have lived in some very depressed areas in the UK, especially after the miners strikes and never was directly affected by crime, so have lived in lower socio-economic areas, and in Perth, lived in a particularly low socio-economic area....................oddly the next street up was in Bentley and is considered more upmarket than St James.

There isn't a clear cut answer here............if I cast my mind back on some of the high profile murders in Australia, many have been where a husband has murdered his wife to get an insurance policy or off her so he can be with his lover, many of these murders have been committed by educated and fairly well off people.Next up would be murders by men against other men known to them.

Drug crime is a big issue, druggies stealing to fund their habit, bored youths commit vandalism and graffiti,sexual crimes are highest in Indigenous communities.

One thing I was warned about Perth was that it didn't matter where you stayed, but you should check out if there were Homeswest houses in your area, even some of the "nice" suburbs have Homeswest houses......................I'm against anything that labels people and don't believe for one minute that all Homeswest clients are dodgy, but the suggestion persists.

So, I would suggest that people do a bit of research on the area they intend to stay in, but remember that one persons negative experience shouts louder than 100 peoples positive experiences.

[HansaPlease]

Yep, I think we agree on most points.

[AndreaL]

The only way to experience and learn about Australia (and its crime) is to live here, others experiences will not necessarily be your own.

You can have a thousand positive experiences, but one negative one tends to stick in the mind. All I know is that I feel safe and never feel scared.

[Donovan83]

I think it's true that Perth has a higher level of crime than most cities over east. This is based purely on my perception though.. in Perth I've seen some electric fences (around used car lot type places) and there's definitely more security in general around.

For example... most Transperth buses have a gate/fence thing between the driver and passengers if the bus takes money in... the busses in Brisbane didn't have this.

Still, it's such a tiny level of crime compared to SA...

[Johnno]

This is what I'm talking about. These friends of ours (ex CT) have been in Aus about 4 months, their container arrived about 3 weeks ago!! Drop your guards and you'll get done! edit, I have removed the persons contact details but it is posted all over FB https://www.facebook.com/perthwacrime

Edited April 13, 2014 by Johnno

[Garrick]

In just over 4 years we have had one incident of crime. And we are 99% sure it was an inside job by some tradies on the night we took handover of our house - they stole taps and showers.

Other than that, nothing. We've lived on the east of Melbourne and the west. Having been a chairman of two different large sectional titles in Sandton, I am quite happy with the level of crime here as opposed to that experienced by people thinking they are safe because they're living in a 'secure' complex.

-G

[OubaasDik]

I think it's true that Perth has a higher level of crime than most cities over east. This is based purely on my perception though.. in Perth I've seen some electric fences (around used car lot type places) and there's definitely more security in general around.

For example... most Transperth buses have a gate/fence thing between the driver and passengers if the bus takes money in... the busses in Brisbane didn't have this.

Still, it's such a tiny level of crime compared to SA...

On the other hand if you want gang shootings, Sydney is your city of choice.

[Bronwyn&Co]

On the other hand if you want gang shootings, Sydney is your city of choice.

Oubaas I'm going to buy you a big wooden spoon for Christmas Edited April 13, 2014 by Bronwyn&Co

[RYLC]

So it definitely seems to be WA where people feel it most.

I've just had a look at the Facebook page for crime in Perth and most posts described the perpetrator as being indigenous. The socio economic problems associated with indigenous people seemed to me to be more acute in Perth than other capital cities because it is the hub of WA. Eastern states have more spread out centres of congregation - Sydney, Central Coast, Geelong, New Castle etc. whereas in WA it's Perth full stop.

Now of course there will be posts saying there is crime everywhere, there is more to WA than Perth etc etc etc but if you have lived in any of the other states you will know what I'm talking about and if you haven't then you won't understand what I mean.

I've always thought it a pity that so many migrants settle in the closest spot rather than exploring the rest of Australia because each state is soooo different.

Edited April 13, 2014 by Crisplet

[OubaasDik]

Oubaas I'm going to buy you a big wooden spoon for Christmas

There wasn't enough double-K-middle-A going on here, so I decided to chip in - not that I'm getting at Donovan.