Is Future For South Afrcia Realy That Bad?

[Eto]

Hi All,

Just thought that I should bounce this off everyone and see what reaction I get, as I see a very different picture when comparing what I read in the news versus what I experience on a daily basis out in the streets of Port Elizabeth.

In most cases I am greeted with smiles when I walk the streets or go shopping. The workplace is very similar as well from tea lady to management and in general I get the feeling that many are trying to make it work even when the odds are against us.

Shopping centres are popping up all around us with the biggest and latest one (Baywest) that opened yesterday. Stunning ctr and probably best compared with Canal Walk in Cape Town I guess.

Yes we all know about load shedding, municipalities that are broke due to corruption, quality of water and schooling on a down, BBBEEEEEEEEE..... gees it sounds like I already answered my own question . However, I always get that feeling that things could actually work and turn out for the better in the long run.

Racing through my mind at present is the question.....do I sit it out in RSA and spend the time with my family and friends or do we pack and leave and start a new life in Australia? This means no more time with family and we are all very aware of how important this becomes once the grand kids arrive, once our parents are old and need help.

Not sure if anybody agrees, but it would be great to hear what your thoughts are.

Many thanks.

Eto

[ottg]

It seems as if they have quite a few left: 46,800

http://www.cnbcafrica.com/news/southern-africa/2015/05/13/sa-millionaires-indians-bee/

More interesting is the composition and combined value - note in dollars:

"According to the study, there are approximately 46,800 millionaires (HNWIs) living in South Africa as of December 2014 with combined wealth holdings of 184 billion US dollars"

[SurferMan]

Damn!

184 Billion USD. I'm so glad Msholozi uses state funds to build and fund his lifestyle! Imagine if he turned those beady eyes and that middle finger to the crusty rich. By my calcs he could reduce that to a Greek level IOU in about, hmm, 3 years.

[ottg]

Its a drop in global terms.....but what are the rich doing with there $ and why do they still borrowing more?

https://www.worldwealthreport.com/sites/all/themes/wwr/images/WWR2015-GeneralInfographic.jpg

The issues the ultra-high-net-worth individual believe could affect their wealth, lifestyles or business......slightly different to me paying my Telstra bill

http://content.knightfrank.com/research/83/documents/en/wealth-report-2015-2716.pdf

What $1m will buy you in m2 property size....and Cape Town is the winner (P29)

Thus every country has its "green island"

[OubaasDik]

I honestly don't know how they count a milionaire.

I left a while ago and I started to get al my money out earlier this year, and Liberty exceeded all my expectations - I'm a MILLIONAIRE in SA terms .... divide by 10 and it's a nice tip, but not something to kill for ....

[ottg]

Unfortunately its measured in USD terms....damn!

At least I'll may be able to make in Zim dollar terms.

[Naomihome]

Yes it is. Unfortunately the majority of people who live here think they are not affected by their environment and live in some kind of bubble with a built in filter. Its kind of frustrating to try to explain the reality to people who choose to ignore it.

[Mara]

Having gone through the transition in Rhodesia, I accepted that one day the same fate would be visited upon South Africa. When we decided to leave RSA 22 years ago, family and friends thought we were crazy, we got all the usual comments, but we were determined to leave whilst we could still get an excellent exchange rate...R2.40 for $1 NZ $.

I am actually sorry to see that what I had imagined is coming to fruition, what a sad state of affairs. This is definitely an instance where I would not have been bothered at all, if I had been wrong.

My heart just goes out to those that find themselves in a situation where they have no choice, they have to stay midst the mayhem!

[Naomihome]

Well we're at the exact point where we wouldn't be able to afford it if we wait any longer. I hope the collapse waits for another 3 years because we're stuck here until then.

[RedPanda]

At least get your money out now, as much as you can.

[RichardH]

Having gone through the transition in Rhodesia, I accepted that one day the same fate would be visited upon South Africa. When we decided to leave RSA 22 years ago, family and friends thought we were crazy, we got all the usual comments, but we were determined to leave whilst we could still get an excellent exchange rate...R2.40 for $1 NZ $.

I am actually sorry to see that what I had imagined is coming to fruition, what a sad state of affairs. This is definitely an instance where I would not have been bothered at all, if I had been wrong.

My heart just goes out to those that find themselves in a situation where they have no choice, they have to stay midst the mayhem!

There is a big difference between SA and Rhodesia (Zim) and even Northern Rhodesia (Zambia) and that is that in SA at the moment you actually can get your money out of the country. In both these other 2 countries this was not always possible. People had to come up with very imaginative ways to move their cash. At least being an economic prisoner in SA is not as certain as it was in these 2 countries during the 70s and 80s.

[Mara]

RichardH, not sure why you needed to point out the huge difference, all I pointed out was the exchange rate. I know we were all limited in the funds and even owned items that could be moved out of Rhodesia at the time. My comment was just a generalisation, stating that once you have been through that, you are probably more aware of what the future may hold for you.

[RichardH]

RichardH, not sure why you needed to point out the huge difference, all I pointed out was the exchange rate. I know we were all limited in the funds and even owned items that could be moved out of Rhodesia at the time. My comment was just a generalisation, stating that once you have been through that, you are probably more aware of what the future may hold for you.

I'm only pointing out that it is an exception that South Africa allows us to remit currency freely this when other African countries don't (didn't). I also think it is an exception that we should all be grateful for since it would make the hard process of emigration even harder by not being able to transfer money with the ease we can today.

[OubaasDik]

I'm only pointing out that it is an exception that South Africa allows us to remit currency freely this when other African countries don't (didn't). I also think it is an exception that we should all be grateful for since it would make the hard process of emigration even harder by not being able to transfer money with the ease we can today.

And I am grateful and am doing my best to take full advantage, while I can.

I agree with Mara otherwise - born in Zambia, lived in SA - prefer Oz

[Naomin81]

I don't have money to get out. It's tied down in property. Can't sell my house before we move. I recently spent my savings on my house to build another room and bathroom because we needed more space for my new kid. My husband also has a townhouse but we can't live in it, it's too small.

Both our properties are paid and we don't have any debt. My husband gets an income from renting out his property, and we also can't afford month to month without that income.

One reason we want to move to Aus is that with our level of education and experience we're not supposed to struggle to survive month to month. My house is old and in a bad neighborhood which keeps getting worse. My husband has a Masters Degree, and he gets 2/3 of my salary. We'd rather immigrate to another country than move to Jhb.

[CyberJoe]

Yesterday at the University of Pretoria (TUKS). Healthy energetic expression of beliefs or boiling pot of racial hate between groups?

 

[RedPanda]

I get very anxious over things like that. I'm so glad we're off in May.

[Fidjet]

I know this is a old post but it's still true. For the last bit i have been looking at SA with graduation goggles, seeing what I'll miss more then why we want to leave. Sometimes it's good to be reminded about why, this is a post I might need to revisit next year when I'm in auz and missing my friends, when I wonder what I did and why on earth I gave it (friends, family "the known") all up. 

[WebGuy]

On 5/22/2015 at 9:32 AM, SurferMan said:

Hi Eto,

My 50 cents.

A new mall is not a sign of prosperity in my view, I would cast my decision net wider than that.

1. Load shedding, getting owrse and owrse. About to sign SA's life away with a secret trillion Rand nuclear deal, which take >10 years to come on line and have a good history of going 2-3 times over budget.
2. Water crisis, it's coming if not there yet.
3. Crime, still well out of any semblance of control.
4. Nepotism and corruption. People getting off scott free.
5. Pamdozi mine. Billions scammed and fast ass Khulubuse Zuma sits on the poor and destitute.
6. Jiba, NPA/Zuma, spy tapes. Mdluli and Co.
7. Eskon, SAA, SARS, SABC, SANDF, and and and the list goes on.
8. Most bloated and biggest Cabinet in the world. Say no more. Fat ass pollies in Parliament.
9. SANRAL. Lying and conniving.
10. Highest per capita spend in the world on education, dumbest students as a result. And let me be clear, it aint the students who are not smart, it's SASCO, SADTU etc et al that stuff it up! No textbooks for years.
11. Marikana, killing our own to protect profits.
12. Andries Tatanie, not a single cop sacked or jailed, despite being caught on film murdering him in cold blood.
13. Fisheries, caught in monster scandal, nobody convicted.
14. Slide of the Rand, since 1994 it has been on the way down.
15. Strikes.
16. Continous looting and "dimands" for stuff, all for free.
17. Xenophobia. Say no more, its bloody racism, i wish people would call it waht it is!
18. BBBEEE. Why can't I have a company and decide who the heck owns it? It's mine, i built it up with my blood, sweat, money and tears. Why am I forced to give it away?
19. Land expropriation. If you bought it fair and square, why can it is taken away?
20. Pet peeve - SABC TV licence. FFS, can anyone here honestly say they watch that propaganda crap? Why can't I have a TV and watch movies?
21. The Zulu king/bigot/Malema/SACP/AZAPO can say Kill the Boer but if any witou says kill the black dude, there would be an uproar.
22. Thuli bashing has become a national sport, and about the only exercise the fat ass pollies get in Parly.
23. Jamming of journalists when the heat gets too much. Dont tell me that was not ordered from on high...

What gets to me is the lack of accountability.

There are good things and good people in SA, I know we have all lived there. But the strikes are getting worse and come next year, it will just keep getting more and more violent.

Sorry, I'll get off my soapbox now.

But South Africa does not have a good story to tell. They had a golden chance to exploit minerals and natrual wealth to build up a vibrant and successful society. Instead they play the race card as though all 52 cards were racism. It's never Governments fault, but always some "third force" or scary Western boogeyman to blame, or white farmers, or foreigners et al.

Aus has issues, I promise you. here in WA, our own Barney has peed our iron ore fortunes into the wind and continues to put his head in the sand. We had to borrow $8 billion just to make it to fin. year end. So we too have Darwin nominees by the dozen. But as least if I call the cops they will come, very soon. If I call the council, I will get through AND attended to. In the same day. It works and everyone pays their fair share, mostly. (Maccas, Google, Apple, dont yet but will soon!) We have pollies who sniff seats in Parliament, crash their cars and get away with it for months.

There is no perfect society, but poor SA is getting hammered left, right and centre. And by the very supposed saviours of "the people" An oxymoron if I ever saw one. .The cherry on the cake for me, the ANC toyi-toying against Eskons decision to fit pre-paid meters. Err, Eskon is controlled and run by THE ANC. So the ANC is demonstrating against itself? WTF?

You can't make this stuff up.

LOL, Im done venting. have a great weekend!

All of the above and more - SA should be renamed - that country you used to know does not eixst anymore.

[Rhyss]

I spend quite a bit of time in SA, 2-3 trips a year. A good friend of mine recently said this in an email.....

 

“living in South Africa things are not as bad as they could be, but things are not as good as they should be!”

Edited May 16, 2019 by Rhyss
fix typo

[new2forum]

legacies linger and the blame game is always played but the truth is the gap between have and have- nots in SA is huge. elite fenced off enclaves remain...so do informal settlements.