Missy: new arrivals

[Riekie]

Missy, I'm curious to what exactly it is that you do. You're talking about being a career woman in a man's world and at the same time about your rewarding job working with children - I'm battling to bring the two together.... It sounds very interesting and confusing at the same time - please enlighten us.

[Missy]

Sorry you are confused Riekie, I am for ethical reasons unable to divulge exactly what it is I do, you have to be very careful in my profession about who you tell what. It's in the medical field and involves corrective surgery on kids. Hope that helps some.

I was also quite shocked here to learn that personal information you enter on registration is viewable to the general public. I think that, that should be clearly stated when you fill in the reg forms. I see you are a part moderator so I wish to make that clear to you here, it should be changed. I even had someone send me an unsolicited message using my full name, I have however since blocked them and removed my full name from this area.

This might seem insignificant to a lot of ordinary posters but I think it needs urgent attention.

Thanks for your time mod,

Missy

[Guest Jules]

Hi Missy,

My, what a charmed life you seem to lead out there in Dubai. I feel that we are almost priveleged to have you here on our forum, taking the time to tell us all about it. Have you cancelled your appointments for the day, or do you have the day off ? Or, perhaps it is just that you really have mastered the art of delegating, as you said it's something that a high powered career woman like yourself has to learn to do. How else would you manage to be the 2nd top poster on the forum today with the high flying career that you seem to have, involving children?

Are you sure that a move to Australia would be the right thing for you? It's just that I can't see you fitting in very well with the locals here. I can predict an unhappy outcome to be honest. Firstly, as Chatterbug pointed out, the Aussies do tend to have tall poppy syndrome and people may not be as willing to allow you to regale them with tales of your success. Secondly, the domestic help issue is just not going to work with you. I seriously doubt that you will be able to live in the luxury you seem to be accustomed to in the Middle East. Thirdly, how will you feel having to trade in your Porsche for a more family oriented car? I just can't see a baby chair fitting into your little sports car, not to mention all that equipment. Besides, sticky windows and toys scattered around the floor are not a good look, and you do seem to love driving it, I mean look how many times you have mentioned it on here already! I don't know, much as I love seeing South Africans leaving to come to Australia I just don't think that it would be the right move for you. Just a bit of friendly advice

[Riekie]

Missy, I can assure you, members can only view the details you want them to see. If you did receive a personal message with your full name, it would have been from one of the hosts and for administrative purposes only - if this was not the case, please let us know so that we can investigate - in fact please forward the unsolicited message to me so we can rectify the matter.

Just for future concerns of this nature, further down the menu is a section specific for forum help and if you are experiencing any problems, please post your concerns there so that we can act on it, as we check that section a number of times every day and your concern would receive immediate attention (if I did not come across it here, it may have gone unnoticed).

[Missy]

Yes members can only view the details you want them to see, after you change them. No-where is it stated that the information you enter can be viewed by the general members until you change it yourself,and or even indicate where you should do this. Something I never did for I dont know how long, at least until I received the message, and looked into it. By this time of course people can take your personal details and do what so ever they wish with them. Not a good idea.

The message I received was not by one of the hosts or the admin, it was a common or garden variety of general public. I have already deleted the message.

Thank-you for your time mod

Missy

Edited June 28, 2006 by Missy

[Guest Seoul Sister]

Very funny Seoul Sister, you are a buffoon

Hi Missy,

Ag Doll, you know how it goes, Buffoon, Baboon, Hong Kong, Dubai, what's in a name ? Right ? Almost makes you wonder who's the cat and who's the out-of-place mouse sometimes..

On the subject of ex-pat wives most that I meet are very unhappy not being able to work, and a lot just live for the moment that they can leave. It is quite sad, because going home comes as a huge shock to most of them. Also a lot take to drinking too much, when the kids go off to boarding school, and the husbands on long trips. There is a high incidence of dependance on Prozac for support. Trust me on this one ladies I am very close to the source of this information.

It doesn't surprise me one bit, in fact it only confirms what I already suspected. You don't get to meet any of the fab wives I was talking of earlier, as they won't have much in common with a high-flying career gal like yourself, who has to work to keep things going. Word of warning out of concern - careful to hang around the above mentioned friends too much, QLD Girl's ideas on soort soek soort come to mind here!

I think we were also spoilt in South Africa with so much cheap labour. But it is a different story outside SA. Maids are expensive, we are paying 3000 usa a month for each one of the three, this includes lodging for 2 of them but not the air tickets home each year or the medical insurance or food. No one says it's cheap. But if it enables me to devote 100% of my time to the precious little kids I administer to, then I am happy. And I am also proud that that I earn a good salary,I certainly deserve it, it also keeps me sane at least compared to the other wives.

Sorry I only see now that my previous sentence was lacking some things :

"The only expats I have known to live like this, constantly pre-occupied with where they live, what they drive, how much labour they can afford (and just what these costs are), what they earn, how much they work, previous engagements/countries of residence and all such boring and often highly-irrelevant details, compulsively announcing it to any willing ear, have been those living above their means."

For a Successful Super-power of the Business World you sure have a lot of time to hang around with us and make small talk ! Ahaaa,(just saw explanation on that from Jules, thanks Toots !) proof of the fantastic delegation skills you were mentioning earlier... Already logged on at 6:03 Dubai time this morning ! *phew* DOLL ! you are clearly not just a travelling sparrow, but also an early little worm catcher !! You must have misread my intentions, I was not making fun of expat wives living the life of luxury and thereby not needing to work. Why would I do that, when there are so many other obvious things to laugh at !!

Love

THE Asian One

PS I will stop sending you unsolicited PM's welcoming you to the forum. Sorry for putting you through that horrendous ordeal, poor darling !! (EN dan nog al die lastige vertaalwerk ook, so asof die skok van 'n vriendelike briefie nou nie erg genoeg was nie ! )

Edited June 28, 2006 by Seoul Sister

[Missy]

What utter nonsense Jules I have a very good working relationship with many Australians living in Australia. And believe me they all drive sports cars and don't seem as worried about it as you are making out . Yes this afternoon I have off. Whats your point exactly? You make some very incorrect assumptions about what I know and do not.

I have never heard such sour grapes before concerning the kind of car and lifestyle I have. Not even from Australians themselves. ha ha ha I am sure our baby will be more than comfortable in my husbands 4X4.

Edited June 28, 2006 by Missy

[Guest Seoul Sister]

Yes this afternoon I have off.

It is currently 11:06 AM in Dubai... Is there something you would like to share with the class ??

You make some very incorrect assumptions about what I know and do not.

Could it be that this actually applies in your case, Missy ??

SS

Edited June 28, 2006 by Seoul Sister

[Guest Jules]

Hehehe Missy, I think it's you who's making incorrect assumptions No sour grapes here I'm afraid. If I could just quote my common or garden fellow forumite I think you might better understand where I am coming from:

constantly pre-occupied with where they live, what they drive, how much labour they can afford (and just what these costs are), what they earn, how much they work, previous engagements/countries of residence and all such boring and often highly-irrelevant details, compulsively announcing it to any willing ear, have been those living above their means."

Enjoy that afternoon off now

[Missy]

Hehehe Missy, I think it's you who's making incorrect assumptions No sour grapes here I'm afraid. If I could just quote my common or garden fellow forumite I think you might better understand where I am coming from:

Enjoy that afternoon off now

Oh dear Jules I think you have got the wrong end of the stick and quoting a post I haven't even read. I was simply describing my life style not bragging. You really are in need of some TLC of the material girl kind. come join Desertdaisy and we will show you how to do it without feeling bad.

[DesertDaisy]

Actually, Missy, I suggest you REREAD my post. I said clearly I don't do the coffee mornings or shopping, and have no designer labels in my life. I do not live in a material world and can definitely not be considered a material girl. I said when I first welcomed you I live in Abu Dhabi, which is just down the drag.

And you mentioned my post on the 4x4 - I wasn't being complimentary. I said I saw my future and hated it. Not because of the 4x4 but because of the mother trapped behind the wheel checking her childs homework at 6am. THAT is not the life I wanted to leave.

You are in an admirable job. My husband is also in the medical field, so I can understand the joy you get from your job. I'm glad to hear you are so happy and doing well in Dubai. Its nice to hear success stories, but its not so nice to hear them end up sounding like brag-offs.

[Guest Jules]

You really are in need of some TLC of the material girl kind. come join Desertdaisy and we will show you how to do it without feeling bad.

Thanks for the offer sweets, but I will have to decline . I'm too tall you see, it would be terribly crammed in that Porsche of yours, especially after having been all squashed up in economy class for the flight over there. Pity, it sounds so inviting, but don't worry, I usually get to put my feet up for a bit after I've finished the ironing ... *sigh* a womans work is never done, hey?

[Guest colton]

You know we SEEM to be giving Missy a hard time here but the fact remains that there are more career orientated ex-pats like herself that have immigrated to Australia. A friend of mine left for Brisbane 2 months ago, they went on a 136 VISA with her as the principal applicant. Her hubby ran his own business in S.A and him and their two children will be following at the end of the year.

She lived the charmed life here in S.A with 2 domestics, live in, because she couldn't get up at night to deal with crying babies as she needed to be refreshed for her powerful career the next day, and a full time gardener/driver for the school run. She like Missy has decided that hubby will be the stay at home dad and raise the children while she pursues her well paying career.

I cannot see it working for her unless she pays the big money and gets full time help in Aus as well. That is what will most probably happen, but I feel that she is setting herself up for hardship as the majority of australians have no care about what job you do, as long as you have one, or what house or car you have as long as you have a life. You know what the australians I know say about us; "we live to work instead of working to live!"

My hubby and I went to a function over christmas in australia a couple of years ago. There were about 30 or so people there. What was interesting to me was that the man next to me was a reconstructive surgeon, my hubby was an engineer and the man opposite me was a waitron in a restuarant. No one cares about what job you do as long as you are a nice person. Needless to say we had lots of fun and realised that life in australia is vastly different from S.A, hence our move!

My biggest pet peave about S.A is if we go to a work function, and my hubby has lots we have to attend, is when I am introduced to the other women as "Colton the engineers wife" or meet "Dr Jones' wife". Do we put such little emphasise on our own worth that we need to be labelled by a "class". I always introduce myself as "Colton" full stop no surname or definition. It always throws people and I can see the wheels in their head turning as they try to make out how to treat me, after all I may be someone they are suppossed to impress! In S.A people find that very uncomfortable because they need to know which little box to slot you in, needless to say I have great fun! I am proud to be me!

Edited June 28, 2006 by colton

[Pippa]

Jules, I really enjoyed your post.

Missy, maybe you should stay in Dubai seeing that you are living such a brilliant life.

Good luck with your decision.

Pippa

[Missy]

Thank goodness Colton, I was beginning to think this was the "anti Dubai sports car driver" club. Some of it I have no idea from whence it comes???

I may assume then that a lot of you who post here are stay at home mums looking after the no1 and the kids. Well I say good on yer, thats your choice. If you have problems with that then I suggest you are not truly happy in your skin. AHMEN.

Egalitarian behaviour is not of course limited to Australia not by a long shot. In fact I think by the sounds of things it is not sitting that comfortably there at all. We were in Paris before HK.....(OK ladies I am not bragging) and I know this sounds ludicrous to the extreme to even have to explain, but yes Porsche drivers sat next to farmers and farmers sat next to doormen and and and. Because you drive one does not make you a snob, it's how you conduct your life that determines that. So for heavens sake, I only mentioned that we have a Porsche and a Merc4x4 to illustrate how CHEAP cars are here. We probably would only have the 4x4 and a run of the mill German saloon back home. AHMEN again.

I think however that the egalitarian nature of Australian society is perhaps a bit flogged to death here? If you are all so well assimilated into Australian culture, the fact that I drive an extremely expensive car should roll of your backs like a duck in water. But the reality tells me differently. You latched onto it completely out of context and went stir crazy.

I hope this is not how you greet all newcomers? They might not have quite the same sense of humour that I have?

[Cindylou]

Hey Missy

Good to meet you - you really have been active since joining, sorry I haven't added my welcome sooner. Just a quick question, 'cos my geography is not good at all, but is HK a suburb of Dubai?

We were in Paris before HK.....(OK ladies I am not bragging)

Anyway, cookie welcome to the forum, you have a GREAT day

Cindylou

[Missy]

Cindylou HK is Hong Kong. A bit of ex-pat talk. Thanks for the wellcome.

[Dedrei]

Missy, welcome. Hope you enjoy your time here.

Ok, ladies and gents. Please cool down with your replies, as I have a feeling it is gonna get very ugly very soon. Everybody has a right to their own opinion.

Can we agree to disagree on a some of the things mentioned. Not everybody has the same ideas/ideals for their life down under.

Thanks

[Missy]

Thanks Dedrei, I appreciate that. Yours was one of the few real welcoming posts,as well.

[DesertDaisy]

Apologies on my behalf for not being as welcoming as I should have. I think Missy inadvertently raised some hackles - and it is our fault for responding a little too aggressively.

The forum is generally a very welcoming and helpful place, at least I found it to be.

[Queensland Girl]

Missy

I have a cleaning service once a week. Two ladies arrive with all their own cleaning materials(including industrial vacuumcleaner) at 9am on Tuesday morning and they are out of here at 11 am. This costs me $80 a week.

They scrub my home and do more in two hours than I could in two full days.

I did my own housework initially and the biggest problem I found was my inability to time manage. As I had always had domestic help in SA and had grown up in homes with domestics I just did not know how to plan my cleaning. I will NOT bore you with the details. Needless to say we had many burnt meals-and lot of white clothes that emerged from my washing machine grey or pink, or whatever boo boo I had made in the laundry.

Now- I have a daughter who is charge of the laundry for pocket money, a husband who irons beautifully due to two years in the army, a son who can cook a mean spagetti bog(OZZI speak for bolognaise) or chicken fried rice. They are all responsible for their own rooms.

But my standards have DROPPED! a little bit of chaos does reign. We also dont iron t-shirts and jeans.

(I admit that 10 minutes in a tumble drier does wonders.)

I also sometimes just close the door to my childrens rooms.

I work from home now so I can do alot in between.

I also have a FANTASTIC SA lady who makes beautiful home cooked meals -and freezes them, and I pop in a buy some frozen meals.

But Missy, I am glad that when I had three kids under four years and I was working parttime that I had my beloved Maria. I admire these amazing young women here who do all that ...and cope. I was extremely lucky to have had this support when I was in that position.

[Missy]

Queensland girl that is the nicest post I have read all afternoon. Practical, helpful and poignant all at the same time. I admire you hugely for how you live.

Starting a family is not just something you let happen it is a well planned carefully orchestrated and well thought out, years in advance. Ok I know for some it is a pleasant surprise, but working full time as I do in an incredibly precise manner I have to be so careful to try and get this right, otherwise it could seriously affect not just myself but by extension others as well. Right down to planning the country to do it in.

I am sure a lot of people find this daft, but the world needs all sorts of people to make it spin.

You seem to have reached an ideal compromise between paying for the job to be done doing a bit yourself and having a co-operative family. It's the tinny tots that I know are going to be the most difficult to arrange, if I might say it like that. When they are a little older I am sure things will settle down a bit. Fingers crossed.

I am sure I will be back to you down the line asking for domestic agencies and the like. You are so right each and almost every-one of us had a beloved Maria of our own, a second mother. No shame in that. Double the amount of care and attention. I would like that very much for my own children, as I know I will be one very busy mum.

kind regards

Missy

[chatterbug]

Hey Missy,

I'm still a bit mistified ( or maybe disappointed by) about your point of entry to this forum with its heavy leaning towards your seemingly superfluous "domestic servant worries". And your apparent lack of insight into the "real issues" of one of the countries you are contemplating for possible immigration - sounds like a good dose of attention seeking behaviour to me! I guess I expected more for someone of your calibre!

Well you surely got the attention - via the "bull in a china shop" approach - and now you seem to feel sorry for yourself because you have not been warmly welcomed. I think there is a good lesson in there about tact, diplomacy and appropriateness to be taken from it all. Sheez you do seem to have a way with words (in the brash, wielding it around like a blunt object kinda way!) Believe me if you got this reaction from SAffer people (most living in Australia and abroad) on this forum who are generally tolerant, friendly and very helpful (but used to the very classist RSA mentality) - most Australians would find your approach downright arrogant and offensive. Maybe not your well to do Australian mates - but I'm sure if you'd start asking them about if there is any industry in Australia (bizarre question coming from someone like you) or if people in Australia are behind the times for not using domestic help you'd have a different reaction.

Its not so much what you say only, but also they way that you say things that, I'd say, get's up people's noses - and I'm not so sure it would only be an Australian thing. You are not dealing with a bunch of kids here after all. You can choose to ignore all of this but I'd say you could use this as a microcosm of the typical reactions that you'd get here in Australia. Then again, I guess, wisdom is not something that you can take a pill for or get via osmosis or some other means!

I personally don't mind a bit of dissent, institutionalised discontent and creative tension on a forum like this, it makes for interesting discussions and certainly some active and passionate participation. The way that you convey this however goes a long way in keeping the conversation civil and focussed on the issues at hand. I guess we have not had the opportunity to see your "heart" in all of what you were putting out. I feel sorry for you in that way because I suspect that your honest intentions have been scuppered by your "approach" to all of this.

I suggest you take a slightly less opinionated approach first up, suss things out and as people get to know you better things will get better! That's how things work with adults in a virtual community! Later I'm sure you'd be able to have a lot of fun, build some relationships and get a lot of useful information

Lets move on form here and get to know you better.

The whole point with the pseudonym thing on a forum is that you get to choose your level of involvement. You choose what you put out there and people will react to what "signals" they get from you. If you choose put out such a lot of personal info about yourself in a flurry - you should hardly be surprised when your "privacy" is "invaded" - Please. Don't blame the forum girl - or maybe you are just not as savvy after all!

Calling it as I see it BUG!

Edited June 28, 2006 by chatterbug

[Mara]

Here is my 2c's worth

I work full time, but have no children at home, they are grown and out of the house.

I employ a cleaning service, he arrives every 2nd Friday morning and spends approximately 3 hours at my home. He cleans the bathrooms/toilets, washes the tiles, vacuums the carpets, cleans the kitchen, removes any cobwebs, does the dusting. For this he charges $22 per hour. In between his visits, we keep the house clean. We do not wear shoes in the house, just slippers, this helps. Twice a year I get a window cleaner in to do the windows, he charges around $180 to do both inside and outside. I do my own washing and ironing, do not have a clothesline, everything goes through the tumble drier, that minimises the ironing.

[Dreamcatcher]

Hi Missy,

I tried to be friendly, and you turned my words around and made me look like a fool It is no wonder you are getting animosity from people. I have no problem with career orientated people, and I admire the fact that you seem to be helping children with huge problems. Please allow others to have their own opinions, and we will all get along just nicely. If it is debates you are looking for, there are some other forums around that thrive on this. We are here trying to support each other, not break them down. I tried to stay out of it after I "lost my battle" but I can no longer just sit here and "watch".

Enjoy the life you have, it certainly seems to bring you great joy and satisfaction. Unfortunately it is not the life for other people, and we really enjoy ours the way it is. We do not have to be the same. Diversity makes the world a wonderful place!

Greetings,

Dreamy

Edited June 29, 2006 by Dreamcatcher