Cartwheels, handstands banned from schoolyard play

[Rover]

I am sorry, but I find this a bit stupid:

http://mobile.news.com.au/national/school-bans-stopping-kids-from-being-kids/story-fncynjr2-1226459601639

How do kids get enough time to develop their gross- and fine motor skills when they can only let loose a bit under strict supervision, which would severely limit their time allowed to play.

[Gizmo]

How ridiculous! Fortunately it appears to be limited to just a few schools in Aus. Plenty of other normal schools left to choose from. ;-)

[Sibella]

Aaah so you found out about the Australian fun police. Don't worry you'll meet them often...

[LizM]

Totally ridiculous

[Rover]

Aaah so you found out about the Australian fun police. Don't worry you'll meet them often...

Don't scare me off now. I can't handle when Health & Safety-types interfere with the risk of enjoying life to the fullest.

[Lynnie]

Nog nooit daarvan gehoor nie.... Maar baie noem die die Aussies die "nanny state"

Gelukkig is dit nie in my seun se skool so nie, hulle doen verseker wawiele en handstands daar na hartelus :ilikeit:

[deroche]

Sorry to go off topic but just also saw that Harry Potter has been banned in one of the Aus schools. I know this has happened in other places (just can't think of them now)

I honestly have read the books and enjoyed them. Doesn't make me evil and not a christian anymore. Just my thought.

[Rover]

It is all about personal choice and freedom. It comes with responsibility.

If the becomes the responsibility of others to make choices for you, you are not free. If you give them that power, you have sold out on your own freedom, regardless of whether it be your religion, or cartwheels.

[joweni]

Banning children doing cartwheels etc is just a knee jerk reaction from the school. As a teacher -we have parents coming in to say their little Johnny hurt his head/knee etc etc. on the monkey bars,swings etc and for some parents they have to find somebody to blame and the school is a favourite target and try telling them that accidents happen!!

[Rover]

Banning children doing cartwheels etc is just a knee jerk reaction from the school. As a teacher -we have parents coming in to say their little Johnny hurt his head/knee etc etc. on the monkey bars,swings etc and for some parents they have to find somebody to blame and the school is a favourite target and try telling them that accidents happen!!

I know what you mean.

And you cannot exactly tell parents their little Johny/Jenny doesn't have the required skills to climb up the jungle gym because of being too sheltered to develop those skills to start off with, because you are then blaming the parents, who are the actual root cause of the issue. And some parents are never wrong...

[Sibella]

Not to worry, I actually find Australia much better (or worse;) than the UK. There the kids didn't have jungle gyms at school, here every school has a few.

I am actually a bit worried about my little one roaming the school grounds without supervision at playtime. Apparently there are playground monitors but I have never seen one.

But then I don't remember ever being watched by and adult at primary school? Whereas in the UK the teachers were always watching the little ones.

Just a different way of life for us to get used to. Once again...

[Bronwyn&Co]

My children's middle school in Adelaide had a '1 metre rule'. All the kids knew they are not allowed to go within 1 metre of each other. The school brought this in due to a lot of running and jumping on each other and gangsta-hugs all round every morning when they arrived at school.

[Fish]

This is a hot topic in childcare at the moment. We have our daughters name down for entry to the new style risk-taking outdoor play childcare facility the Creche & Kindergarden (C&K) association is currently building in our suburb. This article talks about a lot of the stuff you guys have mentioned:

http://www.brisbanet...0615-20fc0.html

"Following the model of early childhood centres in Scandinavia and Germany, the "Centre for Excellence" will feature more than an acre of outdoor space complete with a rainforest, a creek and an outdoor pizza oven."

Edited August 30, 2012 by Fish

[OnYellowBrickRd]

@Fish: I think this is FABULOUS! We learnt so much more during our holidays on the farm and we learned to use our imaginations. The majority of children are kept indoors and are entertained by TV and PC. Getting outside will improve their gross motor skills that will (according to many studies) improve academic ability and problem-solving skills.

[Rover]

This is a hot topic in childcare at the moment. We have our daughters name down for entry to the new style risk-taking outdoor play childcare facility the Creche & Kindergarden (C&K) association is currently building in our suburb. This article talks about a lot of the stuff you guys have mentioned:

http://www.brisbanet...0615-20fc0.html

"Following the model of early childhood centres in Scandinavia and Germany, the "Centre for Excellence" will feature more than an acre of outdoor space complete with a rainforest, a creek and an outdoor pizza oven."

Much better.

[AllisonW]

I am probably going to open a can of worms here but i need to say that generally i find Australian children to be terribly indulged and poorly disciplined. I find that SA kids are taught good basic manners, as a rule and they are not. I notice it all the time, the bad language, the shouting etc. My son had a strict older teacher in SA and just cant believe it when kids in his class shout or just talk without raising their hands. I was at an indoor play area on the weekend and watched a mom ask her kid FIVE times not to throw a ball in her face in the ball pit. He did it over and over again! he didnt care and she didnt lose it, just kept on pleading with the little brat. I was flabbergasted. I dont believe in using physical violence as a primary disciplinary tool but i would wallop my kid if that was me! Although the reality is that i have never had to hit my kids for hitting me or throwing objects at me. They just would NOT do it! Ever. They would just know that its totally out of line.

I know that we had to protect our kids because the environment was unsafe in SA But i think that we didnt pander to them as much in other ways. I was amazed chatting to two moms at my sons school who told me that their kids didnt go on the swimming programme with the rest of the grade because they dont like water. i am guessing they dont have a phobia and my attitude has always been - you need to swim, its a lifeskill, if you are afraid i will support you but your butt is getting in the pool. And my kids have just bravely gone for it. perhaps because we are the kind of parents who say - go for it!

[Bob]

All this sort of nonsense has its roots in litigation.

The school, to cover itself, has to put in place stupid rules so that nobody is in a position to sue them.

. . . . . and we can thank no end of lawyers for this outlook.

My 76 year old mate and his 65 year old off - sider went to the local hardware store, here in Townsville, Queensland to get 6 sheets of gyprock plaster board to line a wall with, each about 2.4 metres long.

Total weight about 50 kgs.

My 76 year old mate had roof bars on his ute (bakkie), but because they were not certified by an engineer and hadn't a sticker on them, the fork lift driver was up for $200 000 fine and his boss of the store a $500 000 fine if they fell off and it got back to them having loaded them up.

Also, ropes are banned. You must use straps nowadays because some people in Australia don't know how to tie a rope knot and they can come undone !!

The ridiculous part was two old age pensioners lifting all these sheets of plaster board by hand onto the roof rack with a perfectly good fork lift behind them, not being used.

Litigation . . . . again.

We can all thank our lawyer mates in Australian society encouraging everybody to sue each other.

No wonder my mate (who has cancer, by the way) called them all parasites on Australian society, getting a new shiny suit every six months and new BMW for Christmas each year out of the proceeds of this sort of litigation.

I'm sure there are more than a couple of other Aussies out there who might agree.

[Bob]

I am probably going to open a can of worms here but i need to say that generally i find Australian children to be terribly indulged and poorly disciplined. I find that SA kids are taught good basic manners, as a rule and they are not. I notice it all the time, the bad language, the shouting etc. My son had a strict older teacher in SA and just cant believe it when kids in his class shout or just talk without raising their hands. I was at an indoor play area on the weekend and watched a mom ask her kid FIVE times not to throw a ball in her face in the ball pit. He did it over and over again! he didnt care and she didnt lose it, just kept on pleading with the little brat. I was flabbergasted. I dont believe in using physical violence as a primary disciplinary tool but i would wallop my kid if that was me! Although the reality is that i have never had to hit my kids for hitting me or throwing objects at me. They just would NOT do it! Ever. They would just know that its totally out of line.

I know that we had to protect our kids because the environment was unsafe in SA But i think that we didnt pander to them as much in other ways. I was amazed chatting to two moms at my sons school who told me that their kids didnt go on the swimming programme with the rest of the grade because they dont like water. i am guessing they dont have a phobia and my attitude has always been - you need to swim, its a lifeskill, if you are afraid i will support you but your butt is getting in the pool. And my kids have just bravely gone for it. perhaps because we are the kind of parents who say - go for it!

Perhaps those mums would be happier to fish little "Johnny" out of the neighbour's swimming pool face down and blue in the face after not surfacing for 5 minutes ??

Some parents just don't get it .

[Bronwyn&Co]

Allison I coudn't agree more. I believe you don't get naughty kids, you get naughty parents! Obviously there are exceptions when a child had a medical issue. It's funny, but my kids were never naughty enough for me to need to smack them (except for the occasional tap on the butt).

But here it drives me nuts! Yesterday I was in a supermarket and this little boy (older than a toddler) was going bananas, screaming etc. His dad was completely ignoring him, actually smiling a little!

I don't know why parents either ignore their children when they call them (mum!mum!mum! And mum doesn't bat an eyelid) or keep asking them to stop over and over. These kids will never learn that bad behaviour has consequences!

Ok rant over.

Edited August 31, 2012 by Bronwyn&Co

[Fish]

I am probably going to open a can of worms here but i need to say that generally i find Australian children to be terribly indulged and poorly disciplined. I find that SA kids are taught good basic manners, as a rule and they are not. I notice it all the time, the bad language, the shouting etc. ...

Ok, given you popped the lid, as an Aussie I'm going to squeeze that can a little further open and say it is sometimes inaccurate to extrapolate from your own circumstances. For example I find the children in my son's primary school very polite and friendly and can't remember hearing bad language from any of them so far. The children we pass on the street or at the shops around here all seem open, friendly and polite and we haven't had any trouble at all. But I'm not going to extrapolate my experience out to be the general experience of Australians just because that is all I see in my life and surroundings. I know demographics play a big part and it is very hard to generalise without living in many areas over time. You wouldn't have to be South African to react to a child throwing a ball in your face 5 times. without trying to dismiss everything you say as I'm sure you have some valid points, some of what you are discussing sounds more to do with the type of parent you are personally and I understand as a migrant it can sometimes seem like everyone is different to you...

Ok, who wants the can of worms next

Edited August 31, 2012 by Fish

[joweni]

Hi Sibella

ALL public school HAVE to have teachers on duty during recess times-it is a huge part of our duty of care. Every recess and lunch break there has to be a certain number of teachers on duty-in every school I have taught at since arriving in Oz there is always a roster .Please check with your school-no child is allowed to "roam"free-teachers are there to supervise and keep play areas as safe as possible for the kids while trying to give them time and space to do what kids should be doing-playing,hanging out and being children.

[LizM]

The OHS stuff really gets my back up to a point. I was an Lieutenant in the Army Cadets in Oz and found the over zealous nature of rules because of OHS just stifled a number of activities we could do.

Wrapping children up in cotton wool even further, not letting them be physical... well IMO that's going to lead to an even GREATER obesity epidemic than there is already.

Oh, I had my hand broken when I was 8 when the fatest boy in school was pushed onto me (sitting down). I dislocated my elbow at school doing gymnastics - my parents would NEVER have even considered "suing".

Edited August 31, 2012 by LizM

[Bob]

My wife, a 4th generation Aussie, who has taught for over 35 years in primary schools in 3 states in Australia and also in England for a year, pointed out the comment made by a Brisbane headmaster on TV this week.

He stated that most of the teacher's time at his school is taken up monitoring and controlling the disruptive behaviour of one or two kids in the class, to the detriment of all the other kids who don't end up getting a good day's lessons taught them because of the time wasted on these naughty kids.

That is a common trait in the schools where she goes relief teaching from day to day here in tropical Townsville.

It's not the kid's fault . . . rather the lack of parenting that they go home to.

[Sibella]

Joweni I'm exaggerating there are playground monitors. But the school grounds are large and the kids run all over the show. The first few weeks of school in Prep my daugther got herself into trouble playing with bigger boys and even trying to go out the grounds. She was just not used to the freedom I think as in kinder there are gates and constant supervision.

The teacher explained to her that she needs to stay in the Prep area but as there are no physical boundaries it's not that easy for them. So when I go to help out at the school I see her and her friends running around the side of the school where there aren't supervision.

[AllisonW]

Fish,

I agree and disagree. Firstly I started by saying i was generalising and I was. As a social scientist I know that my experiences are not sufficient to create a hypothesis about the state of all children in Australia. And i have certainly encountered polite australian kids, including my neighbours children and some of the children at my son's school. My son also went to play group, occassional care until his kinder was approved and there were polite children there.

I am a stickler for good manners. Dont get me wrong I have two boisterous boys aged 5 and 8 and they can test my patience! But i constantly try to reinforce the manners issue. So my value statement above definately reflects my parenting style and in that you are correct. However, in my previous SA life i worked with children extensively and i know that black, indian and white children in SA generally are parented in a style that places high value upon respecting elders etc. I know thats also a cultural generalisation and i know that south african parenting has its own major challenges.

But I also need to qualify my statement because i dont think its an Australian problem alone. Its a first world problem. I have travelled in the US and Europe and often find similiar permissive attitudes amongst parents.

So i do agree with you but my day to day encounters generally still point to a more permissive parenting style in Australia, with, in my view some decline in childrens behaviour. But once again, for some parents this may not be problematic. For me it is and I am quick to remind my son that I am still the same South African mum and that nothing is going to change in terms of appropriate behaviour, consequences and rewards.

But finally my golden mantra with parenting is - each to their own.... Doesnt mean i am not going to have opinions on it and comment but it is really your business how you want to raise your kids...

Edited September 3, 2012 by AllisonW