the Bible is true

[Michele R]

Hi Toitjie,

You brought up some interesting points. I also don't want to start any fights, and I feel if you believe in something, you shouldn't let a debate sway your belief, so I think it's healthy if we al discuss things even if we don't agree.

The Bible is a book that has been translated for thousands of years and added onto, edited, so we don;t really know for sure what the original text was. We have some indication from older versions that have been found, and there are some differences regarding that version and the modern version.

It also interests me because we need to remember that any written text will be written from a certain person or group's point of view. That's why the second testament deviates from the Jewish scripts. It's also quite interesting to note that during the time when Jesus was alive, he was not the only person performing miracles and calling himself the son of God. I don't say this to stir anything on the forum, I'm just stating what's fact. I'm not saying that he wasn't the son of god, I just think it's interesting.

[Alida]

Yes, the Bible was translated often, mistranslated often and I too think that there might be some stuff we might have lost, but, if you think about it: Jesus said in the New Testament that all who heard His Word, will in the end be judged by His Word. He would not say that if He knew that Scripture would be so twisted at the end of time by people that no one could believe what it say anymore. It would be a complete unjust statement to say that people would be measured against the Word of God if God knew it would not be available anymore. I believe that God is still sovereign in the whole universe and that He would certainly be able to preserve His own Word till the end of times, in order for His commandments and teachings to still be valid and true up till the very end. I believe we can still believe the Bible, but yes, make sure you find translations closest to the original. I found the King James as an English Bible and the old Afrikaans Bible to be closest.

Interesting thought: Imagine you would like to break an army's power to defend and function, what is an excellent way to do it ? Amongst others, to break the chain of communication ! The Bible is likewise God's communication to man. It is no wonder it's been tampered with so much ! But I believe God is sovereign and completely able to preserve His Word. God Himself said that nothing should be taken away from or added to His Word. He knew people who do not want to serve God would try this, so He gave this command clearly.

Just my thoughts.

[Selma Swarts]

Ons het ook die DVD's gesien. En ja hy sal hierdie bogenoemde mense verkeerd bewys!!! Veral Darwin. Ek verbly my net dat ek deur n wonderlike God gemaak is en nie van n aap afkomstig is nie.

Whooo hooo, ek sekondeer daai een. Hy is n wonderlike mens en het ook baie van my vrae beantwoord.Dis n jammerte dat hy en sy pragtige vrou in die tronk moet sit en dat sy familie so geteroriseerd moet word deur die (enemy).Hoe dan nou ook anders nie waar nie,anders het satan ook nie sy werk gedoen nie. Ons moet net bid vir hom en sy gesin.

[Selma Swarts]

Whooo hooo, ek sekondeer daai een. Hy is n wonderlike mens en het ook baie van my vrae beantwoord.Dis n jammerte dat hy en sy pragtige vrou in die tronk moet sit en dat sy familie so geteroriseerd moet word deur die (enemy).Hoe dan nou ook anders nie waar nie,anders het satan ook nie sy werk gedoen nie. Ons moet net bid vir hom en sy gesin.Jesus was te vinde tussen die siekes en prostitute , nie die slim en rykes nie.

Christenskap is n leefstyl nie n dinominasie nie, Ek as christen en mens verkies om die volgende te glo "God spoke the world into existance" and one day He will speak my name in affectionate tones

[kobus2]

Hierdie ou is 'n totale crackpot. Die aantal conspiracy theories wat hy aanhang is 'n bladsy lank, lol.

Niemand is teen hom nie, hy het sy tronkstraf oor homself gebring deur belasting onduiking stelselmatig oor 'n lang tyd. Hy het geweet wat hy doen.

Mense is wel geneig om ouens soos hierdie en Jimmy Swaggert etc te gebruik as voorbeelde hoekom Christenskap nie ernstig opgeneem moet word nie. Ek probeer nie dit doen nie - slegs uitwys dat hierdie betrokke persoon se idees beslis nie ernstig opgeneem kan word nie.

Dit is naif om mense wat krities is oor sekere idees onmiddelik af te kraak as "van die Wêreld"etc.

Van my kollegas by die werk se kinders is by die plaaslike Katolieke skool, en baie gelukkig daar.

Edited September 13, 2009 by kobus2

[Preacher]

Oh good god.

There are people here who think the world is only 6000 years old? That is not faith, its madness.

Im not religious. I just dont understand why evolution itself could not be Gods plan? After all, when science does debunk religion you guys are notorious for shifting the goal posts anyway. Just make an accommodation for evolution. It is has more scientific evidence than the Christian bible does I am afraid. Thankfully, they teach this in school now. Religion has no place in public schooling anymore

[Cyberdeth]

Preach for me preacher. I'm with you 100%

[Preacher]

Preach for me preacher. I'm with you 100%

Even the topic name is absurb

"Scientific proof that the bible is fact"

(all while we try to debunk science with exclamations of faith and belief)

[ystervarkie2006]

You guys debate a lot.....

I would strongly suggest that each of you do some earnest research before you decide which "theology/theory" you want to defend.

Diligently read the Bible with an open mind and heart and ask that it reveal truths to you.

Similarly, critically read scientific texts/journals and see what you can learn.

And you still won't have all the answers.

I am a scientist and I have the greatest respect for scientific reasoning, I see the beauty of God's creation in nature and I honestly believe He will gently reveal himself to those that earnestly seek him. I encourage anyone to earnestly seek to know the living God. It's worth it.

PS: I personally don't follow the teachings of Dr Hovind, but that doesn't really matter does it?

[Alida]

To each his own. I'd rather believe what I believe and at the end discover that it didn't matter, than to not believe and at the end discover it mattered the world.

[Selma Swarts]

Oh good god.

There are people here who think the world is only 6000 years old? That is not faith, its madness.

Im not religious. I just dont understand why evolution itself could not be Gods plan? After all, when science does debunk religion you guys are notorious for shifting the goal posts anyway. Just make an accommodation for evolution. It is has more scientific evidence than the Christian bible does I am afraid. Thankfully, they teach this in school now. Religion has no place in public schooling anymore

I am just curious as to where the name Preacher comes from, from a self confessed "not religious"30year old know it all.

Leave this discussion to us"religious" people,and find yourself something else to mumble about.

[Preacher]

All due respect, but when you post a topic about religion and you include the word science in the title, you invite people who are not going to share your views.

You are entitled to your beliefs. So am I though and I dont expect religion to be forced down the throats of our kids anymore. Christianity and religion have been responsible for more wars and have stifled scientific development for years. Right now, stem cell research, which could cure cancer and cure irreversible diseases, cant be studied because the happy clappies think its against Gods will.

When someone tells you they believe in fairies? You know how you think them slightly mad? Thats what I think of people when they tell me they believe that Jesus is the son of God born to a virgin.

There is no fact in the bible. Only myth which you can place your faith in. You are free to do this. Please dont expect that the public schools should continue forcing that nonsense down our childrens throats. Just because evolution calls the validity of your religion to book does not mean that evolution is automatically something that we should not study. It has more evidence and support than the bible does.

Noahs ark? I mean really now.

[Preacher]

To each his own. I'd rather believe what I believe and at the end discover that it didn't matter, than to not believe and at the end discover it mattered the world.

Yes, because Gods way is for us to live in fear of hell and love him to avoid it rather than question everything and grow as people.

[Spider]

Okay guys, I think my post might have been misunderstood. So I would like to apologize if I in any way offended, mocked or tried to convert you guys. It was not my intention. I just wanted to air my views WRT religion in general. I'm not trying to single out any one person or religion though. I will hereby refrain from posting any of my own personal religious views. I DO respect your life choices, and would appreciate you respect mine. There are a lot of different points of view out there though. But again, please accept my sincerest apologies, and this will be my last post on this thread.

i put in bold what should be the key in ANY religious discussion. No one has a right to tell people they are right and wrong but also there is nothing wrong to have a different opinion and share it - so when people do that dont shoot them for it. everyone is different and embrace that respect works both ways is a saying for a reason

[Toitjie]

i put in bold what should be the key in ANY religious discussion. No one has a right to tell people they are right and wrong but also there is nothing wrong to have a different opinion and share it - so when people do that dont shoot them for it. everyone is different and embrace that respect works both ways is a saying for a reason

Chandi, you are so right! i have "preached" in just about every thread about these types of issues, that everyone is different and entitled to their own opinions.

I have never said anything about my own beliefs, apart from the fact that I believe in evolution, and the saddest thing is, I have more than once recevied a cyber cold shoulder. Just because my beliefs are a little different. I honestly dont think I will have a lot of blog friends left, people just dont accept other's beliefs. To a small degree, I do understand that, I was like that myself once, where I flatly refused to talk about evolution, fortunately I made a very dear and good friend who taught me that we can all get along, believing and non-believing, without getting so worked up about it.

anyway, if I can resist, I wont comment anymore on these types of discussions...

[Spider]

Chandi, you are so right! i have "preached" in just about every thread about these types of issues, that everyone is different and entitled to their own opinions.

I have never said anything about my own beliefs, apart from the fact that I believe in evolution, and the saddest thing is, I have more than once recevied a cyber cold shoulder. Just because my beliefs are a little different. I honestly dont think I will have a lot of blog friends left, people just dont accept other's beliefs. To a small degree, I do understand that, I was like that myself once, where I flatly refused to talk about evolution, fortunately I made a very dear and good friend who taught me that we can all get along, believing and non-believing, without getting so worked up about it.

anyway, if I can resist, I wont comment anymore on these types of discussions...

i think its just people do it in a way that its like "i'm right and you wrong" or make people feel stupid for believing what they do which is not fair to anyone....i have so many friends and family of very varied beliefs and i too have gotten cold shoulders due to my beliefs which is sad...people are quick to say dont judge until they disagree then they judge

[Patty]

Religion misapplied has sadly had many casualties, and the same applies to the theory of evolution. Hitler said the following in "Mein Kampf":

"If Nature does not wish that weaker individuals should mate with the stronger, she wishes even less that a superior race should intermingle with an inferior one; because in such a case all her efforts, throughout hundreds of thousands of years, to establish an evolutionary higher stage of being, may thus be rendered futile."

[Willem en Luzelle JvR]

I've been quiet for a while, but here goes...

Preacher, Cyberdeth and Toitjie

I haven't completed the series by Kent Hovind, but I'm close to the end. If any of you have watched the series on the Bible and Evolution and still feel the way you do, fine, but this topic was started because of an impression left in me after seeing this DVD's that a lot of questions about the Bible are unnecessary.

This thread isn't about denying anybody his right of an opinion or a religion, but will help Christians overcome the burden placed on them and their children through misinformation by the science community and mostly, people believing in evolution.

If a lot of the 'facts' supporting evolution have been proven wrong, just face it, maybe it is wrong.

What normal thinking person will be able to come to the conclusion that all life forms as we know it evolved from a chemical mixture and differentiated themselves into plants, animals, insects etc. Have a look at how an egg develope into a bird or a reptile-it is not a random shot in the dark and millions of years that caused that-people, I live on a farm and experience these 'miracles' and realise that if Charles Darwin had lived in the 21'st century, he would have gotten to different conclusion alltogether and stuck to his faith in the God he studied for years.

To conclude-if you haven't watched the DVD's, you are misinformed about this thread and won't be able to contribute positively-keep the negativity for yourself, please.

This thread is still posted under 'spiritual life'-if you don't believe in anything like that, you're bound to find it hard to get along with.

Kind regards to you all, especially Preacher, Cyberdeth and Toitjie

[Selma Swarts]

Wel gedaan Willem, ek het gewag vir julle reply.Ons het ook die dvd's gekyk en ek dank die Here vir die feit dat so iets op my pad gkom het.

God sorg vir sy kinders, die duiwel aan die ander hand ook.

[Cyberdeth]

[Toitjie]

selma, i rest my case. Am i from the devil now? How arrogant

[Cyberdeth]

Guess my 1st class ticket to hell will come in handy then ;-) The dark lord will welcome me with open arms.

Edited September 14, 2009 by Cyberdeth

[Selma Swarts]

If the shoe fits people if the shoe fits!!! I'd rather open my eyes and see there truly is a God, than to open them and see there truly was a hell

[Cyberdeth]

For some people, hell IS heaven.

[Selma Swarts]

For some people, hell IS heaven.

I am happy for you,you have found your mission in life

Your opinion does not apply to me......thank Goodness

I think this better stop as it is turning into a waste of time for the poor people interrested in the actual post Willem started.

Toodles