Paying SA Debt??

[Heymanse]

I'm glad to say that we are currently debt free in Oz, although we've only been here since June this year. However, this is the attitude we're aspiring to live to from now on. Apart from incurring debt when we'll probably buy our own house one day, I don't want to see myself in the same boat as in SA. We've bought a 1996 Hyundai Lantra in good condition cash and will save up to buy another cheapy but at this point, with the public transport system in a far better state than back in SA, we only need the one vehicle.

To come back to the Australian culture allowing us to "down scale" our lifestyle and the vehicles we still haven't sold, we were never trying to keep up with the Jones's. Rising fuel prices and interest rates forced us to trade in our Nissan X-trail for a Nissan Micra and after almost 15 years in the same company and very hard work and savings I bought myself a second-hand Fiat Panda, giving the bank a deposit of R20 000 from the sale of the Fiat Uno I previouly owned. We're a family of 4, also not small children but my kids aged 12 and 16 just had to adjust to the long treks to the coast when we visited my mum in the Micra, with a Venter trailer coming from behind because there were no luggage space (obviously). Thanks to the Northwest Municipality, we weren't able to visit my in-laws as often as we would have liked to, because the main reason for us buying the X-trail in the first place was not for the sake of saying: "Hey, look at me, I'm driving a 4x4!", it was merely that we'll be able to visit my husband's parents on their farm in the Northwest Province. To get there, you'd travel 60km of gravel road but since the Municipality didn't scrape the gravel road anymore, it became nearly impossible to get to the farm without a 4x4. We did one trip with the Micra and even at a speed of 15km/h it sounded and felt as if the chassis was going to fall out any minute. When we did our final trip to say goodbuy to the farm and family there before we left, we decided it would be better to get a hired vehicle that will be able to drive on the gravel road - thanks to the Northwest Province Municipality, I wasted more than R3 000 on that trip but at least the Micra was in one piece and is still in good condition to be sold.

Now all that needs to be done, is to get them sold - but I don't want to have that burden on my mind anymore - let that be the financing company's problem. We've got more than enough to worry about here than to add to our frustrations and stress levels.

[Navigator]

I agree Polly!

Also with the exhange and cost of living a DECENT car in SA (Say in the R250 000) range could easily chew up 25% of your salary, where-as the same car here would cost you 10% of your salary at most

I disagree - you don't need R250 000 for a DECENT car in SA. You don't always have to buy new (as you lose about 25% of your money after driving off the showroom floor), there's lots of decent, reliable secondhand cars on the market. I drove a Jeep Grand Cherokee, and the wife a Renault Clio, both very reliable and in excellent condition, and we didnt' even get close to R250 000 for the two vehicles combined. I'm not criticising those of you with new and DECENT cars, just stating that you can get around reliably and safely for a lot less money ...

[Danie]

My 2c...

As you are not planning to return to RSA but merely visit, and you are planning to close off all deals as best as you can, why not consider to do the "insolvent" route.

Give back there car, and whatever is left over will not be covered by yourself.

Do the paper work and get yourself 'certified' as insolvent.

Just an idea.... your credit rating is anyway going bust, do it the 'legal' way.

D

[Brissy Bessies]

Good for you Danie for getting back to the point of the original discussion.

Do you know if one would still get a tax clearance this way?? We're on 457 and are planning on going the permanent route one day. How can you go insolvent if you are working but in another country? Am I being doff? Just weighing out all options here.....

[Brissy Bessies]

Good for you Danie for getting back to the point of the original discussion.

Do you know if one would still get a tax clearance this way?? We're on 457 and are planning on going the permanent route one day. How can you go insolvent if you are working but in another country? Am I being doff? Just weighing out all options here.....

[dabb]

My 2c...

As you are not planning to return to RSA but merely visit, and you are planning to close off all deals as best as you can, why not consider to do the "insolvent" route.

Give back there car, and whatever is left over will not be covered by yourself.

Do the paper work and get yourself 'certified' as insolvent.

Just an idea.... your credit rating is anyway going bust, do it the 'legal' way.

D

Hi

I agree with Danie - why not make an appointment with an insolvency lawyer, they might not even charge you for the 1st consultation and then you know how to it the legal route - no court orders, emmigrants getting a bad name etc. and also no outstanding debts to worry about.

D

Edited October 15, 2008 by dabb

[SpitFire]

Hi

I agree with Danie - why not make an appointment with an insolvency lawyer, they might not even charge you for the 1st consultation and then you know how to it the legal route - no court orders, emmigrants getting a bad name etc. and also no outstanding debts to worry about.

D

Sounds ok, though how does it affect your current status in Aus, and don't you need to declare your new income and bank statements/possessions etc?

Sorry I don't have a clue how it works!

[Brick]

What would happen if you kept parking it in higher risk areas and at night etc, it might get stolen and then you woulnd't have the car or a bad debt, assuming it's at lease insured for the amount oweing?

[Kapoen]

What would happen if you kept parking it in higher risk areas and at night etc, it might get stolen and then you woulnd't have the car or a bad debt, assuming it's at lease insured for the amount oweing?

now there's an idea

[MANDYL]

The insolvency route might not be the answer either as you need to have some assets in your estate as it must also be a benefit to the creditors.

[Heymanse]

Sounds ok, though how does it affect your current status in Aus, and don't you need to declare your new income and bank statements/possessions etc?

It doesn't affect your status here. They're not interested in your debt or what goes on in your bank account back in SA. For that matter, they're not interested in what goes on in SA, full stop.

Edited October 15, 2008 by Heymanse

[dabb]

Sounds ok, though how does it affect your current status in Aus, and don't you need to declare your new income and bank statements/possessions etc?

Sorry I don't have a clue how it works!

Hi

Sorry, forgot you are in Oz. Do you have a family member/friend that can contact somebody for you in RSA and help with the documents? I think it might be worthwhile - but it is just an idea. Perhaps the lawyers on the site can help. Another idea, perhaps there are some Gauteng attorneys on the web that does insolvencies?

Good luck

D

[GTrotter]

I am not going to join the debate on the morality of this. But one point to add if you are working in financial services your employer will more than likely draw your credit record in SA when they do a background check. This was the case when I joined a bank in the UK.

[Jeanne]

The insolvency route might not be the answer either as you need to have some assets in your estate as it must also be a benefit to the creditors.

What options are left if the person can't even resort to insolvency?

[Kitten]

I think that the only option would be to approach your bank and make an arrangement to make small payments till you have paid off your debt. At least you are making the effort and doing the right thing.

[Lienq]

Just 1 question for ya all...why did you try to keep up with the Jones' over in SA anyway?

It is going financially tough with everybody even if you do not try to buy the best of everything to impress.

If it is going financially tough because of circumstances out of your control, fine, but if you are suffering because of your own doing.....need I say more?

[MarcK]

I agree with Kitten. Lending institutions would rather get some money than nothing... The only downside is they will hammer you with the maximum interest and penalty charges that can be levied in terms of the Usury Act. But at least your conscience (and record) is clear.......

[Willie en Liezl]

We are going over on a 457 and planning to go the PR route once there. We do have some debt and we are going to pay it off.

It's a moral thing... and you never know what might happen in the future.

[Eva]

We are going over on a 457 and planning to go the PR route once there. We do have some debt and we are going to pay it off.

It's a moral thing... and you never know what might happen in the future.

I'm with you on this one!

Like the TV license ad says "it's the right thing to do"

[Julian (Jules)]

Buying material things and then walking away from the product plus its associated debt with no intention of paying it off is a form of THEFT in my opinion.

It's not about getting caught later on - it's about what is right or wrong. Not settling YOUR debt is wrong, regardless of whether you can "get away with it." And the irony? Many people emigrating list the reasons they are leaving SA and things like theft and corruption are listed as why they are leaving. Then some of them plan on bending (breaking?) the law as they leave.

When I left SA I settled all my debts because it was the right thing to do. You can't escape ethics.

[bluebonnet]

I'm so glad that Australia's culture allows us to "down size" our lifestyle.

I get the impression that in South Africa everyone aspires to driving the latest Beemer or Merc.

This sort of aspiration only adds to debt being incurred and booked up, with the disadvantage that you owe $$$$ all the time.

The secret to living the "Good Life" is to save . . . not to incur overdue debt.

You can be a blue collar worker all your life, like me, and still have substantial savings later on life IF you save. For years, here in Australia, I'd drive an old 1984 Suzuki van to work. It did 440 000 kms on the clock by the time my last day at work arrived in May 2006. Since then, I've been living the good life off my investments and savings.

I save in the form of shares, especially, which give a good return if you get the right stocks, but you can also save in money in the bank if you like, although you'll never be a millionaire that way.

So . . . . all you folks that think you have to drive the flashest rig in town . . . . . it's keeping a helluva lot of you guys stoney broke, by the sounds of it!

I agree with you. It will always puzzle me why people buy vehicles, homes, ect. ect. that they cannot afford. Look at the USA, I get the impression SA is not much different. And to walk away from your responsibilities.???? I have found my secret to living the "Good Life" long ago. Just came back from a wonderful Italy vacation, already planned another one over Christmas,,, all on savings. But I have to admit,,,I drive an old, ugly looking little car, who cares??

[SpitFire]

Wow!

I can't believe how quickly this became a 'I'm better than you cause I paid off my debt' thread. Go back to page one people. The intention of the thread was to find guidance on how to pay off the commited money, not how to get away with not paying it. I'm very happy for you if you were the wiser person, able to do so prior to leaving SA, though not everyone was in that situation. A lot of people left thinking that they can send money home, though in their current situation they're not able to. Yes there were one or two suggestions that you should just let it go, though nobody actively encouraged 'doing a runner' and not paying it. NUHOME and Heymanse asked what the best approach was to take care of these responsibilities, not how to get out of them.

[Heymanse]

Thanks SpitFire!!

We still haven't decided exactly what we are going to do about our situation. I just wish people would stop judging other people when they don't know their circumstances. We were not one of the lucky ones to step off the plane, with a job offer and an apartment already paid for. Whatever little savings we brought with us, were spent the first month on living expenses and a cheapy car to get around with.

Many people, including myself, are not able to afford to pay their debts, not necessarily because they were trying to live above their financial means, but because of circumstances out of their control. And here I'm talking about the rising interest rates that had a very bad affect on the house market and second-hand car market. We had to pay approximately R30 000 in on our house just to get it sold. We paid in on our vehicles just to bring the prices down so that it could get sold quicker. Its been over 4 months now, and still absolutely no sale whatsoever!! When you are a family of 4 with only one person earning a very small income, when you don't have money in the bank and do no know with what you are going to feed your family with, nevermind how you're going to get to work the next day when there's no money for a bus ticket even, then it gets difficult for me to say, "OK, we'll keep on paying approx $1000 a month for something that doesn't get sold back in SA." I have never backed out of my responsibilities and agree that you should pay what you owe, nevermind what. But then, I never thought that I would find myself in this position. I'm doing my utmost best at this point to find a job and hubby is trying to find a job with a better pay, its really tough guys and I guess it just rubs me the wrong way when you pass judgment on others when they really cannot afford to honour their commitments.

I'm not here to pick a fight with anyone, just to simply say that everyone's situation differs from the next and can we please just respect that.

[SpitFire]

Fully understood buddy! I'm actually looking for someone offline who could possibly advise on this! Will get back to you if I get any clarity!

[Navigator]

Heymanse - look at the bright side, sooner or later things will go better. I wish you all the best in finding a job, and trust that you'll be able to get all the stuff back home sold. One of my friends is going through similar problems, trying to sell his home in South Africa, and doing a balancing act with the available funds.