Spelling & special needs in education system in Aus

[Dedrei]

Hi guys

Maybe some of you who have kids in school here can clarify something for me.

We went to dinner last night with our adoptive Aussie mum & dad and we got talking about the education system and she explained to me how it has changed in Aus.

She tells met that Aussies don't teach the kids to spell in school at all. They are learn the phonetic way and nobody cares how you spell it. That's why most Aussies can't spell at all. This is just really baffling to me how they are doing this. How do you teach a child English, without at least learning to spell. This apparently changed a few years ago.

Another thing that was mentioned was that the aussies don't have special schools anymore for those with special needs or disabilities. They are all integrated into mainstream schools. So you will have a class of 25 and there might be a blind, deaf or a child with a learning disability within the same class. This also doesn't make sense to me as the teacher, I'd think, would spend more time with the kids that struggle than the rest of the class. They stopped it also few years back, because it was discriminating.

Please tell me your experiences and what your kids are doing.

Cheers

Dedrei

[Dax]

Hi Dedrei,

I can only speak for South Oz, and my school where I teach in particular.

We really stand on spelling and Grammar learning in our Middle Primary Unit at my school. I concede that there may be schools and other Inter-State systems where there might be a diffrent emphasis, but at my school we tend not to leave things to chance.

Throughout the South Australian system there is a strong focus on literacy, and the written/reading components are of particular importance.

Also, SASCSA (the South Oz curricullum system) is an outcomes based system, and in the Area of English, the outcomes expected from Reception to Year 10 in respect of Spelling, Grammar as well as Literacy per se, form part and parcel of one's teaching practice.

In my class' case, in order to address the needs of various kids in my Year 4/5 class, I plan a spelling programme addressing different levels of skills and needs for each year group. It's hard work, but in such a class a "one-size-fits-all" approach won't work.

So. I rather prefer to work a bit harder, and i know I have 5 or 6 groups chugging along on their different levels of ability and each kid is "getting there."

Cheers,

Dax

Edited October 19, 2007 by Dax

[Enrica]

I disagree Deidre, well at least in WA my experience is that they do place a lot of emphasis on Literacy and Numercy skills and dont forget good handwriting!!!!!

I have 2 boys that started school here in Perth, have changed schools twice and and quite happy with

the fact they they can spell and read well for their age....thanks to the teachers.

With regards to children with disablities, yes certain disablities are mainstreamed with full able bodied children . Most schools have assistant teachers that spend a few hours a day with these children. Most goverment schools have a special ed unit to cater for the needs of these children.

On the one hand I can see your concerns on the other hand the spin off from this is that our kids grow up realising that even though some one might ne "different" they are part of society. I find that Australian kids are far mor tollerant and accepting of peopel with disablities. They are not hidden away in society and are not treated like freaks.

There are pros and cons in all education systems, but at the end of the day I beleive as long as your kids are happy and enjoy going to school and learning....thats all that matters.

[Sam]

I think that is the situation all around the world. Governments can't afford to have an educated population. And I don't mean financially...

Edited October 20, 2007 by ~Sunflower~

[DesertDaisy]

My kids are at WA school, and I have no problem with their spelling - my daughter (age 7) brings home a spelling list of at least 20 words every two weeks. She is however, way above her class average, and gets "extra" spelling.

What I do have a problem with is the fact they aren't taught computer skills from a young age. I'm also not convinced that the WA syllabus is that great. Its way behind the British syllabus, but I think is the equal to the South African syllabus in most things.

[Aneldari]

Hi

I believe it differs from school to school and state to state as well.

About the spelling: The school that Johan and I teach at, have very good primary school teachers, who pay much attention to spelling. They even have different English lessons: Spelling lessons and then comprehension as well. Yesterday I did a relief day for a Yr 3/4 class and in one of the lessons they had to write a spelling test. They get their word list each week and at the end of the week they write a test.

About the special school: That's also not true because we have a state special school right here in Port Pirie.

About computer skills: They do teach computer from a young age here, even the reception year (6 year olds) have a computer lesson or more each week.

Have a good day all!

Regards,

Aneldari

Edited October 20, 2007 by Aneldari

[MzT]

My son started here in Gr2 and he has been drilled on spelling and numeracy skills (counting, times tables etc) on a regular basis. Each week a large portion of the homework is devoted to practicing these skills. Also the general concensus is that the phonetic method of teaching to read and write yields greater results than the older "look and say" method. I can't really say that I have found cause to worry.

Most state schools have a special education unit for kids with learning disabilities, which I think is a great thing. My son was in there when we first moved here as he was having a few problems, and they were extremely dedicated and after a couple of months he could cope fine with the regular classes. I personally think it's a better system to try and integrate people with special needs into the regular schools rather than to have them in a special school. With the special education unit these kids don't end up keeping the rest of the class back but can progress at their own pace in whatever area they struggle with and enjoy a normal school life in all other areas.

[Cindylou]

Some "special needs" children are integrated into the normal school system - my niece and nephew are at a Catholic school and there are "special needs" kids there. These kids have a teacher's assistant who sits with them and helps them in all their classes. These assistants also aid the other kids when "their" kid doesn't need them. The aim is to integrate these kids as much as possible as well as teach the other children acceptance and tolerance of differences.

Can't speak for the spelling, but I think you already have your answers. So, Dedrei, when's the happy day?

C'Lou

[Annette]

Dedrei,

It's always worth bearing in mind where a comment like that comes from. People who make sweeping statements which they seem to think can apply to the whole of an entire country (for instance), would be ones to take with a pinch of salt IMHO (I know these are friends of yours, so please don't feel insulted). Just because one person has a bee in their bonnet about one thing, doesn't mean it true. This is especially true of older people, bless them, who find change hard to deal with at the best of times.

One thing to keep in mind with the education system in Australia is that each state is quite different from the next. Not only that, but the teachers here are trusted much more to implement whichever method suits them and their individual learners best. There is no "one size fits all" approach. (Thank goodness!). What you friends may be referring to is the different method of teaching kids to learn to read? It is in my opinion much better for a wider range of kids, whereas the "old" method only really works well with the top 10% (in other words the brainy ones). I can assure you that any school (and teacher) worth their salt will care very much how a word is spelt! My son in year 7 does a spelling test every week. And it's really difficult as well!

Regarding special schools, they tend to be for those with severe learning difficulties (ek praat nou van "ernstig vertraag", as ek dit so mag stel ), Why shouldn't those who can cope in the mainstream system be discriminated against? I can tell you that it absolutely does increase tolerance in society a lot. And it's so brillaint for kids to see, for example, how a deaf kid commincates via sign language, or similar. A lot of students will have support assistants that help them, so the class teacher will not be distracted from paying attention to the others. Students tend to get a lot more individual attention here in my experience anyway (I'm talking South Aus schools, and of course the ones we have been exposed to)

There are schools which are of course not so great and teachers who are not good either, but that is the case everywhere in the world. Can anyone on here say with all honestly that each and every teacher they had throughout their schooling was the best they had ever seen? I seriously doubt that.

There does seem to be a tendency in certain more conservative sectors of the press and especially those which love sensationalist headlines, to exaggerate certain concerns they may have. Unfortunately you will also get those people who wil lap up everything that they read in these certain newspapers (and on certain TV channel's news broadcasts!) without question and without checking out the facts for themselves. Watch out for those people who will at the drop of a hat tell you just how much everything has gone into decline since they were younger. Also watch out for those snobbish types who make uninformed and ignorant statements about things they have no experience of.

For instance, just yesterday I had an unbelievable conversation over lunch at the very exclusive private school where I work. The person I was talking to was going on about how state schools don't have any sports at all, how the teachers there are too lazy to coach and the parents just couldn't be bothered... etc. etc. Min weet hy - My children attend a local state school where they not only have a choice of around 15 different sports on various levels of ability, the school is also state champion in two of them and did very well in competition in most of the others! What a dufus! He also seemed convinced that no state schools offer rugby at all - while my kids' school are the disctrict champions in rugby in one of their age groups and also offer touch rugby for girls! O mense, ek moes my tong baie hard byt! The main characteristics of this type of idiot is that they are so convinced of their supriority and so arrogant, that they will not even check whether anyone else has any alternative experiences...

Edited October 20, 2007 by Annette

[Queensland Girl]

Hi Deidre.

I think this is rubbish.

My daughter is dyslexic. In Soth Africa she was placed in a remedial school for two years and then mainstreamed again.

In SA in the mainstream education I had to pay for ongoing support.

When we came to Australia she was immediatly from day one assisted and supported in the Special Eds Unit of the normal school. Most schools have them. She is now preparing for her Matric year and will most likely do well enough to do the Bachelor of Nursing.

A friend of mine has a child who has Aspergers. She has him in a State School and QKLD edu as appointed him his own Special Assistant who works with him in intergrated classes and in the Unit.

Spelling- this is a worldwide phenomena. Spellcheck and computers have changed alot of things. My sister-in-law is studying junior primary teaching and has two children in Qld State systems and she does not have any of these concerns. Her mother-in-law was the Principal of an elite Private School in SA, and she is extremely impressed by the the junior school curricullum she has witnessed .

[Dedrei]

Ag jissie guys thanks so much for clearing this up. Was so worried that I will have a child one day that can't spell.

Good to know we have some teachers and parents on here that have gone through the whole thing and know what really happens.

As for the special needs, that all make sense now and I am all for it Didn't know the schools had their own little special eds section and that some have their own teacher's assistant.

Just learns that you shouldn't always believe what your told.

Thanks, no my mind is at ease. AS to the question when, well maybe next year sometime I'll have some good news to share.

[Guest Bronwyn]

If you want to help your child with spelling, let them read, read, read! Make an effort and take them to the library every couple of weeks. If they read for half an hour a day they will never have any problems with spelling.

There are some very interesting children's and teenager's books around these days. While I loved my Enid Blytons I concede that times have moved on. Today you get Goosebumps, Jacqueline Wilson, Aussie Bites (for the little ones), Carolyn Wilkinson, etc. These authors and types of books really grab their attention and make them want to keep reading.

Our kids (at a State school in South Australia) do Lexile testing 3 or 4 times a year. This is a type of computer-based comprehension designed in America. They answer questions about a piece of literature, and based on their literacy levels, a reading list is recommended, which also usually includes some classics like Roald Dahl, Jungle Book, etc. depending on their age & stage. With the Lexile score you can see how they are improving, and they get rated against their peer goups.

I don't think the schools are to blame for decreasing levels of literacy, but the way our society has turned towards TV and computer-based entertainment in the past 20 years. The instant gratification of Playstation is better than wading through a thick book.

Edited October 20, 2007 by Bronwyn

[DesV]

Hi Deidre

My son has a spelling test every Monday, they are then given the list of words to take home and get tested on the same words on the Friday. So spelling is there. As for special needs in my experience. Border line kids or kids with certain special needs ( where is is believed they will cope) are placed in mainstream, this is all part of no discrimination, often these kids will have a teachers aid. Severe special needs are normally allowed to attend special schools. however where possible special needs kids are in mainstream there is special allowances such as additional staff etc.

Beste

Des