Oh my Word! In the news today! RSA is done...

[Riekie]

Just saw this in the Aussie news today!  Totally totally shocked!!!!  WTH?!

 

http://www.news.com.au/finance/economy/world-economy/the-time-for-reconciliation-is-over-south-africa-votes-to-confiscate-whiteowned-without-compensation/news-story/a8a81155995b1adc1c399d3576c4c0bc

 

I thought things will actually improve now that Zuma is gone.  Didn't take them long....

[ChrisH]

Sad sad sad, it actually seems like they are proposing that ALL land (not just agricultural) be state-owned and then leased to the owner of the permanent fixtures on it.  Interview with Malema: https://t.co/Q9j1kXL64U

 

[Riekie]

Sherbet!  

[Riekie]

We just had a conversation here in the office about how this would affect South Africans possibly being able to qualify for refugee status but the key word here being "persecuted" has not been defined by the UN to allow for future adjustments leaving it open for interpretation by each country.  Australia's interpretation focuses particularly on "serious harm": 

 

(a) A threat to the person’s life or liberty; (b) Significant physical harassment of the person; (c) Significant physical ill treatment of the person; (d) Significant economic hardship that threatens the person’s capacity to subsist; (e) Denial of access to basic services, where the denial threatens the person’s capacity to subsist; (f) Denial of capacity to earn a livelihood of any kind, where the denial threatens the person’s capacity to subsist. 

 

So, essentially the fact that your land is disowned but you're still allowed to live on it, would not be considered as serious harm under the above definition.  Also note the words "significant and physical" which further defines the criteria, making it exceptionally hard to actually qualify as someone being persecuted. 

 

Australia's interpretation & application of Persecution:

http://epublications.bond.edu.au/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1271&context=blr

[RedPanda]

I think the headline is a bit premature and sensationalist. What the article actually says is that they have embarked on the first steps of a long process to legalise this. Knowing how RSA works, this could still go either way. But as it stands, it is troubling news.

[iambrettstar]

The motion was passed in parliament, and will now go to a committee to review the constitution and report back by 30 August. The constitutional amendment would then need another vote in parliament (though if the motion passed the first one, it's highly likely that the constitutional amendment will pass again) - though there's no mention of when exactly this will happen.

 

I guess if you are considering buying a farm, you should hold off a bit...but I think your apartment in Benoni is probably not under direct threat for the time being.

[CyberJoe]

Wow, that news article really does feel a little too sensationalist! That being said, land claims was one of the direct reasons why we decided to leave South Africa in the end. We owned a house in Brummeria close to the CSIR when one day we received this little notice in the mail stating that our house was part of a land claim and we were not allowed to sell or lease our property without approval from the South African Government. Any developments we wanted to make on the property from the date of notice has to be approved by the South African Government lest it be deemed illegal. No, I am not kidding, this is already the law in the Restitution of Land Rights Act 22 of 1994.

 

The claim was preposterous, stretched for nearly the whole eastern area of Pretoria and included facilities such as the CSIR. The person making the claim was referred to as Victor Lekhuleni and even his own people thought he was a fraud. Yet, the South African government proceeded to publish his claims in the Government Gazette lending credibility to his story. Worse, if you as land owner wanted to dispute the claim, YOU had to initiate legal proceedings within 60 days. Of course you pay for this out of your own pocket whereas the government acts on behalf of the claimant. https://rekordeast.co.za/42579/massive-land-claim-shocks-parts-of-pta/

 

Now you might think, there is nothing to worry about and surely this wont matter? The claim will just be invalidated? I can only share my experience but the timing was horrible for us. No person in our area could sell their house even if they wanted to since you are legally obliged to notify people of the land claim on the property. Eskom had constant blackouts with load shedding so I wanted to invest in solar panels & my mom had to move out of her house and we wanted to develop and add an apartment to the one side of the property. Who the heck do you notify in the SA govt? No one was even willing to listen. Then of course, the big debate, do we actually spend the money on development and building when the property value just fell significantly? Property values dropped by 30-40% for people who opted to sell and even when the land claim was lifted, the area was seen as less sought after because the claim can just be submitted again. I hated every damn second of that time, it was beyond ridiculous.