WHY??!!

[Dora]

Look, with all respect and understanding, surely it would be easier if everyone could send you off with a happy blessing and with joy in their hearts. I must admit, that I don't really care what friends and colleagues think, but I do care about the family.  You must remember that it is a grieving process for your parents and close relatives. If you are a close family, for them, it is like the death of a child or a grandchild.  As difficult it is for you, it probably is more difficult for them.  People grieve differently and you can not take that emotions away from your parents. You have to allow them to feel what they feel and you have to respect that.  It will get easier. I experience a little bit of the same but let them be for now, it will get better...

[WayneAndMel]

Fair enough Dora.

[Peterthe1]

All I can say with regards to this post is that anybody who has the opportunity to leave and doesn't is not really thinking ahead. Who cares what other people say, it's your and your families future, nobody else's. With regards to family, make the most of the time while you are there and then live your life. Life goes on, whether you're there or not. I say this from experience. I left the sunny SA 15years ago with the usual BS about leaving from friends and colleagues. My family was pretty neutral (my father, brother and son) and not to supportive. I left because I wanted a better future then what I could ever have in SA, so everybody else can jam there opinions. Fast forward a few years and life carried on. I was in contact with family via internet and all were busy with their own life. 5 Years ago on the way from the UK to Oz, my partner and I went via SA, to see family and friends. It was almost as if I'd been forgotten. Everybody was busy with there own life and I was just a visitor. Forward a few more years. End of last year I got a dreaded call, my father had passed away (at 83). I felt depressed for a while but it would have happened whether I was there or not. I still had my future in Oz though. Yesterday I got another dreaded call, my brother had passed away (at 54).This would have happened whether I was there or not. Still getting over this one but I still have my future in Oz.

My son is struggling to find work (wrong colour and all that) in the sunny SA and regretting now that he didn't leave sooner when he could/should have. He is the one with no family now for support and his back against the wall in SA with a not so rosy future in sight.

The point of this little story is that anybody that has half a chance to get out of SA should grab it with both hands and run with it. Don't be blackmailed emotionally or in any other way to stay. Life will carry on in SA , whether you are there or not but you will have a better future not being there. There are opportunities where ever you go.

[Alchemist]

You learn in life to stop allowing ppl who are not invested in your life to give any advice whatsoever in how you live it......that said the only sadness is about the grandparents of my child, but however sad they may be in this choice, it is the future of my daughter that trumps all other feelings and opinions.....I keep it simple. I am very nervous to leave this place (as bad as its getting) in to the unknown, but having had violence touch me personally (my mom was brain injured by a home invasion and even with that its hard to leave here) I know the best path for my child is one where she is not hated for her skin colour. Sadly, the ANCs manifesto over this weekend where the crowds sang about arming themselves (against who?) is not leading to a country which will be good for white people much longer. Heaven help us if the EFF gains more ground.....

 

Edited June 6, 2016 by Alchemist

[Deezo]

We have somewhat of a different story in that my wife and i both haven't told anyone other than friends or family that are already living abroad.

We chose this route because we want to get the visa in our hands and then tell everyone as we have seen the sarcastic "i told you so" when someone doesn't leave or it was all talk and no action.

 

We are serious about leaving South Africa and the only thing that could stop us is if South Africa becomes a country where the rest of the world closes its doors on, but i doubt this would happen because even refugees have a chance!

 

My wife and i only have our single fathers behind who don't have much going for themselves which is really sad but our only REAL concern!

Friends will come and go and in the end if you are really good friends then it doesn't matter what end of the globe you are living in but we feel if we can support our fathers from Australia earning dollars then this would be more than what we could do for them in SA!

 

We will also be able to travel more frequently then what we can do no with the Australian dollar so the future doesn't look so grim as everyone thinks - bar the few few aunts, uncles and cousins we see more often there is your own life that needs to be taken into consideration and anyone that loves you dearly would support you no matter what as they would only want to see the best for you!

 

Those with their noses held up high are nothing but bitter individuals who would probably contact you once you are settled in Aus and ask how does this whole thing... work so make your own decisions and don't EVER let the actions of others detract you from your dreams  

Edited August 8, 2016 by Deezo

[WayneAndMel]

We can relate only too well to some of the snide comments many people have given us both and I've already mentioned my parents own unpleasant behaviour here. Mel has gotten some stick from people at her work including unnecessary below the belt insinuations of racism . 'Perth-packers' is a derogatory comment I've also heard from some academics in passing.

 

However of late we've had several friends, some a bit more distant than others, or associates suddenly messaging us in private via WhatsApp or Facebook asking a lot of questions about us emigrating from SA. It then emerges they're also concerned about SA and have begun thinking about emigration for themselves. Just, they're reluctant to voice it openly and want us to not share the details of the conversation with others. Sometimes it's really odd timing like at 10:30pm on a saturday night.

 

The phrase they also often speak/write is "My husband/wife doesn't want to leave SA...". I often sense they also need to walk down a psychological road to reach the point of wanting to emigrate and that those are the first steps.

 

So despite the loud denunciations one gets from some people there are also those quietly watching those selfsame loud denunciations thinking that you're actually right.

[Mel-B]

Its a long and sometimes lonely road. We have supportive people (our parents) and then not (everyone else). Every single sentence from our other family / friends is so defensive. It gets me down. I would send a picture of us having a braai, sharing it with our family. Then a typical response is: "we also braai here, we braai all the time". I send a picture of us playing at a park - because I am sharing the journey - then a response is "we also have parks and jungle gyms"... 

 

So childish. I think denial and an inner struggle is at play with non supportive's. If someone moves and they are happy - I am so happy for them. if they don't and they are happy - I am so happy for them. Why so much sour grapes?

 

It seems this is something we all need to deal with. I am reluctant to say or share anything now as it feels like I am hitting a defensive wall.

[RedPanda]

1 minute ago, Mel-B said:

Its a long and sometimes lonely road. We have supportive people (our parents) and then not (everyone else). Every single sentence from our other family / friends is so defensive. It gets me down. I would send a picture of us having a braai, sharing it with our family. Then a typical response is: "we also braai here, we braai all the time". I send a picture of us playing at a park - because I am sharing the journey - then a response is "we also have parks and jungle gyms"... 

 

So childish. I think denial and an inner struggle is at play with non supportive's. If someone moves and they are happy - I am so happy for them. if they don't and they are happy - I am so happy for them. Why so much sour grapes?

 

It seems this is something we all need to deal with. I am reluctant to say or share anything now as it feels like I am hitting a defensive wall.

I'm often totally stumped by people's jealousy and childish "Me too! But I'm better! We are winning at life!" attitude.  My view is a lot more in line with: Do not judge other people; you have no idea what their journey is all about. And my favourite: Live, and let live...let live! special emphasis on the last part.

I have been very fortunate in life, that my friends and family really want to see the people they love be happy in their own lives, whatever that means to the ones in question. So it's really difficult to see what other people do to the ones they love. I just want to sit them down and give them a lecture about releasing the people around them from their own desires, and finding joy in how those people flourish in their own lives! (basically: there is your body, it's a boundary. There is your life, it is also boundary. Stop washing your personal space over everyone else's and invading their space.) This will also release people to focus on their own lives and allow them to evaluate what they want and what will make them happy (that does not involve using other people like Sims).

Shoh! Sorry, rant over.

But this topic is close to my heart, because I see the contrast so sharply between my own experiences and what happens to some of my friends. (It makes my blood boil, just a bit)

If this happens to you, just remember that the people perpetrating this behaviour are not strong and independent in their own identities, and have quite some personal development(maturing) still to do. The unfortunate reality is that this development is not mandatory, and does not happen by default, and many people just never do it. You guys (who are posting here) have my sincere empathy. I hope you make wonderful friends on this side, who want you to be happy the way you want to be happy.

[ChrisH]

30 minutes ago, Mel-B said:

Then a typical response is: "we also braai here, we braai all the time". I send a picture of us playing at a park - because I am sharing the journey - then a response is "we also have parks and jungle gyms"

 

What a stupid response from somebody that you're sharing a moment with...  You can braai and go to a park in Iraq as well (you might not necessarily want to), the difference in Australia being you don't stand with the remote panic button in your pocket just in case.

 

We haven't told too many people for the same reasons mentioned here, the strangest response I got from my BIL was: "You know they'll victimise your child there"   Interesting comment seeing as he is at the short end of the BEE scale in South Africa and might not even get into university one day no matter what his marks are.

 

I think most people left in South Africa have an internal conflict going on, a conflict between wanting to believe there is a future here (coupled with love for family and friends) versus the in your face evidence that we're on a downward trajectory with Zimbabwe setting a good example of what the future could hold.  People often get resistance when they make a difficult decision and you'll likely find the people who give the most resistance are sitting with the biggest conflicts of them all.

[ottg]

Just returned from a 2-week holiday in Indonesia visiting various islands and places

Observable was the large population (~300m), bad infrastructure, low income groups and strong 3rd world component. However the children seems all happy, smiling and all well fed and all living in harmony despite the large disparity and strong roots within religious groups (Hindu & Muslim). Presence of police everywhere. While the overall unemployment is only 5-6% there are pockets with 30% unemployment.

What does this have to do with the topic. Despite their differences people support one another and it starts within themselves. You are not responsible for how other people feels and their opinion is only that; an opinion. See it as that and no need to react on it.

Often they arent in a position to make the move because (comments from RCIS)

"........ look at a long-term graph going back to 1990 covering the whole period since the ANC has been in control of this country’s economy during which the Rand has lost value at a consistent annual average rate of 6.5 percent a year. That figure has stripped the average South African of the ability to travel abroad and made it impossible for most pensioners to follow their children to Australia and other emigration destinations. It is really hard to remember that when the ANC took power in 1994, the Rand/Dollar exchange rate stood at R3.52 to the US Dollar. So it has halved in value and then halved again in the interim"

 

Edited August 17, 2016 by Mara
spellin

[Theshi]

we also decided to go that route, tried picking people's brains e.g. close friends and family only to find out they are so happy here. it was a lonely exercise as it was just my husband and I and no one else besides the agent to talk to then we found the forums which made the process not so lonesome. as you read other people's struggles, fears and joy, you discover so its not just us feeling this way. after we got our grant letters, we told only close family and friends for fear of getting negative feedback from people who are too scared to take the plunge...now those very same people who did not understand why we want to emigrate are the ones asking for advice??? i feel, if someone succeeds in doing something celebrate with them don't belittle them. emigrating is not easy. its a lonely exercise that works better with support from those that you love and care about. i console myself regularly by telling myself better days are coming...fresh start...my parents and mother in law are the ones i worry about most. i know this move will afford us the ability to look after them even better than what we are doing and the fact that children that we will have that side will automatically be Australian citizen is just the cherry on top. its important to keep our eyes on the ball to constantly remind ourselves as to why we are making this move... even when we go home, its only close family not our entire families that will bid us farewell at the airport, the rest will find out months later...just don't need negative vibes

[Dora]

8 hours ago, Mel-B said:

Its a long and sometimes lonely road. We have supportive people (our parents) and then not (everyone else). Every single sentence from our other family / friends is so defensive. It gets me down. I would send a picture of us having a braai, sharing it with our family. Then a typical response is: "we also braai here, we braai all the time". I send a picture of us playing at a park - because I am sharing the journey - then a response is "we also have parks and jungle gyms"... 

 

So childish. I think denial and an inner struggle is at play with non supportive's. If someone moves and they are happy - I am so happy for them. if they don't and they are happy - I am so happy for them. Why so much sour grapes?

 

It seems this is something we all need to deal with. I am reluctant to say or share anything now as it feels like I am hitting a defensive wall.

Mel-B, on a lighter side, if they throw that braai or park comments again, just throw the safety, lifestyle or education card right back at them. SA can't trump that at this stage ...

 

But seriously, my daughter went to a birthday party the other day at a popular venue in Centurion with very impressive, Australia like, park play equipment. But I think that you have to pay min R50 per child to play there plus whatever mom and dad have to spend at the restaurant. The free parks over here is in a sorry state in few and far inbetween....but again its probably comments dealt by people who don't have the Australia option and have to keep on telling themselves that this inward lifestyle is ok. Just hold your head high and don't take these comments on yourself.

[Shellfish]

20 hours ago, ChrisH said:

 

We haven't told too many people for the same reasons mentioned here, the strangest response I got from my BIL was: "You know they'll victimise your child there"  

I've heard it all  from "Australia is so racist...." (and yet I find the levels of general intolerance in SA quite a shock every time I go back) to Australia is a nanny state (maybe but rather a nanny state than a police state) and even that everyone in Australia carry's a gun (from someone's who has never been here). And we had it two-fold, from South African's and from the Brits in the UK (which is where we lodged our application). I think people need to reassure themselves that they are doing the right thing...

 

Equally, I did also/ do also get people saying that they'd been to Australia and it was awesome or that'd love to live here so it swings both ways. 

[Riekie]

If what you experience at the moment is not enough to make you want to experience another (potentially better) life, then you're not ready to make the move.

 

Nothing could have stopped us to leave - nothing!  My dad gave me a book on the worst criminals in Australia to read! Seriously?! Family & friends would constantly tell us "they say" horror stories about Australia, we would receive Emails with links to anything and everything negative about Australia they could possibly dig up on Google!  Even the traffic and the hole in the ozone layer was thrown at us!  And none of them have ever been to Australia!  

 

Now who do you believe?  The thousands of people who flourish in Australia or the ones who think Australia is nothing but a backwards desert island in the middle of nowhere, plagued by savage aborigines.  (Yes, we had that too!) Your current mind-set will have you believe what you WANT to believe and there is unfortunately nothing you can do about that.