Initial Visit

[Maxie]

How many of you have done/consider an initial visit to your 'new' home country?

Is it worth the money?

[Lourisa]

We will see oz for the very first time the day we landed there after the approval of our visa. We decided a few weeks ago to emigrate and, seeing that we want to get out of sa as soon as possible, there will simply be no time - or money - for a LSD trip. We've heard so much good stuff about oz and also listened to the neggative stuff people have to say and in the end, I think, we will have a much better quality life there than is sa. So we're going without seeing our new country first.

Good luck to you!

Lourisa

[Erica]

we are going over in august just to see

but it seems a bit senseless - my husband is admanent it is the right thing to do but the funny part is we are going whether we like it or not - I just smile and indulge the madness for now

Guess it would be nice to see and look around and not land totally wide eyed and clueless

[Guest colton]

If you do a search you will find there was a very long post about whether a LSD is worth it or not. We did, and initially after coming over on a LSD we decided NO, it was not for us. Came back twice and now we live here, I would suggest a LSD because you can have an idea and prepare yourself because Australia is not like SA as most people think. The people we know who haven't settled never did a LSD and their first trip out of South Africa was to immigrate, a big culture shock to them and they were never truely happy, expected too much I suppose?

[Lourens]

Hi Maxie,

My personal opinion : if you've made up your mind already and you're going for the right reasons an LSD trip is not always required. We followed the same route, made our minds up, applied for our visas and I've arrived in Adelaide about 2 weeks ago. My wife and kids are only coming over in May (after our furniture has arrived), so I'm using the month that I'm here to sort things out, discover the city and surrounds, find a house, etc. and start my job. As long as you keep in mind that there will be times that you have doubts about wether you've done the right thing, but that's when you keep reminding yourself WHY you decided to leave in the first place. That's what's keeping me posigtive at the moment - it's hard but it's worth it! Every day this new country shows me things that make me realize just what we've been missing out on in SA ...

Good luck,

Lourens

[Rison]

There is already so much information on the internet these days that the optional LSD trip seems very expensive. A LSD trip is a bonus who those who can afford the cost. When I left RSA I already made up my mind that I am leaving for good (returning not an option) so for me it was not a matter of being selective where I land, but finding a suitable job/opportunity to permanently live and stay in Australia (anywhere) and resume my life from there. I did some research prior to leaving RSA and that was enough.

[Marlene]

How many of you have done/consider an initial visit to your 'new' home country?

Is it worth the money?

If you have the money, why not go on a holiday? If you have already decided to leave, a visit in my mind is really a waste of time and money. BUT all to their own!

We came to NZ totally blind!! We went for a visit to Aus a while back, purely because the company paid for everything.

[Ajay]

In our case, I had accepted the job offer and our decision was made, but we took the opportunity to come over for 8 days to look around and treated it as an early anniversary gift If I were on my own, I wouldn't have needed it, but the trip made the world of difference to my husband and made the relocation a million times easier for him.

I don't think that there is a right or wrong approach here - if you can afford it, then the LSD can be a nice little holiday and the chance to have a look around, but if you can't afford it, it isn't as though things here are so foreign that you will be shell shocked if you arrive without having done an LSD first.

Ajay

[The Parsons Family]

Hi

We came here without doing the LSD thing... We have been here 5 months and I don't believe an LSD would have helped us settle in quicker.

We had two plans of action once we arrived in Australia:

A - Settle down in Australia

B - suck it up and settle down in Oz

Going back wasn't an option, many friends/family said "if it doesn't work you can always come back", I believe that if you start out believing this it will be very difficult to settle anywhere.

Good luck

[Guest Lara]

We're on the same wavelengh! I totally agree. A LSD would have made no difference.

Hi

We came here without doing the LSD thing... We have been here 5 months and I don't believe an LSD would have helped us settle in quicker.

We had two plans of action once we arrived in Australia:

A - Settle down in Australia

B - suck it up and settle down in Oz

Going back wasn't an option, many friends/family said "if it doesn't work you can always come back", I believe that if you start out believing this it will be very difficult to settle anywhere.

Good luck

[Annette]

If I were on my own, I wouldn't have needed it, but the trip made the world of difference to my husband and made the relocation a million times easier for him.

I don't think that there is a right or wrong approach here - if you can afford it, then the LSD can be a nice little holiday and the chance to have a look around,

Ajay

Exactly the same in our case. People are different and in our case, I'm the one who makes things work wherever and can be happy in whatever circumstances once I've made a decision. My hubbie is highly critical and set in his ways and he was the one who needed more of a "preparation" for what was to come. I'm not sure a negative opinion from him would have made an awful lot of difference to our decision to move, more of where to in Australia than whether to. He came on his own ...

Parsons Family, I also wholeheartedly agree with your opinion of "if it doesn't work out ... etc." . I think it sets one up for failure from the start. However, some people do seem to need that kind of "opt-out clause" in everything they do. To those I would say, set strict time limits, e.g. promise yourself not to make any decision until you have been here a set number of years (2 seems good IMO).

In the end, IMHO, attitude is all - it will make or break the success of emigration, whether anyone came on an LSD or not...

[matman]

Maxie - LSD is a preference thing - it is like investing. If you are more towards the high growth/risk end of the investment scale vs someone on the low risk side of the scale - I think this is a good indicator of whether an LSD trip will benefit you or not - because relocating/immigrating is like an investment an investment in your future and a big one at that. Bear in mind that this analogy does not fit everyone, but from personal experience it seems close enough.

For me personally I am at the high growth end of the scale and so when we looked at this - we saw immediatley the opportunity (high risk - major return) Also we did not have much time for an LSD as from start to arrival in Aus was 3mnths. However we had made our minds up and that whatever happened we were going to come out for 2yrs - no matter what happened and then we would make a final decision.

Where a high growth investor would be happy to do research on the internet get advice from this forum etc and feel comfortable with an informed decision. Also dont get me wrong - We didnt just grab the visa and go - We still did our homework and made sure that odds were stacked in our favour - there is a difference between a risky/to good to be true investment (if it is to good to be true then it is) vs a well researched high growth investment and we had kids to think about.

For someone on the low risk side just having information is not always enough - low risk person will want additional re-assurances and therefore for someone like this an LSD is most probably the best thing as it will allow you to see the country, see the schools, get a feel for the place and give you a sense that when you mak ethat investment your money will be safe and you will get a return.

Caveat to all of this - no investment is ever 100% guaranteed - there is always risk hence why it is an investment - but through knowledge/information/planning you can limit the risk

So like any investment plan you need to sitdown and draw up a list of pros and cons and expectations (return on investment) - then force rank each point by priority and negotiability (is this a negotiable issue or can we live with/without it) The reason I make this point is becasue you will have to make changes - For example I would have weather as an item - now if you live in Jhb where weather is pretty good all year round - SO if you say we are non-negotiable on weather - it has to be the same or near the same and it is a high priority. This does a couple of things - it limits firstly where you are going to relocate and potentially limits job opportunity. ANother contentious one is maids/gardners - If you were one of those lucky people to have both in S.A. this could be a major change coming to Aus - You can have them in Aus but it will cost you, so are you or hubby prepared to do ironing or gardening. So what is the priority/negotiability of this and based on decision what will it cost you - bear in mind the cost may not always be monetary - in this case if you do own ironing - it could be time, whicn means you have less time to do something else.

Then like any investment model - you should look at the worst scenario outcome - what if the investment tanks - what will that mean or do to us. In the case of relocation is this an option - do we have no choice but to make it work, or if after 2yrs we dont like it - can we go back to S.A. or look elsewhere - what are my worst case scenario options.

I am a bit of a number/see things in black and white and grey kind of person - makes it easier for me to think and make an informed decision. So apologies if this bored anyone - but it made our decision process easier and hence no LSD required.

The other thing you should asolutely do and it amazes me how many people dont have a budget. Look through this forum and search on "budget" "living" SItdown and draw up a detailed budget based on what you think/know you will earn vs cost of living - there was also an excellent post on what it costs to immigrate/relocate.

just my 10c - inflation you know

rgds

matman

[Marlene]

Going back wasn't an option, many friends/family said "if it doesn't work you can always come back", I believe that if you start out believing this it will be very difficult to settle anywhere.

Agree 100%!

[Johan Swanepoel]

The comments made here makes a lot of sense so far.

We are landing the 27th of April without an LSD trip, the thinking was that you cannot really experience a country in 2 weeks.

I am just not sure that you would know in 2-4 weeks if you would be able to settle down in a countr? (That is unless it is a dodgy place, which we all know Australia is not)

That is my 11c :-)

Regards

Johan Swanepoel

[Guest colton]

Seems like most people don't do the LSD, on this forum anyway. Nothing wrong with that, each to his own and I agree you cannot see the true country in 2 weeks but you can experience first hand things that are a concern to you. Originally when we were going to come over I was bringing 3 pre-teenagers with me and after experiencing actual teenagers here I was adamant my children were not going to be brought up in Australia.

My brother has lived in Australia for 8 years now and so when I came over for his wedding a couple of years later I met alot of their friends who are australian, or have lived here for many years. Not doing the tourist thing but actually going to the schools and meeting people with teenagers I realised how sheltered our children are in SA. They are not as exposed to as many worldly things as they are in Australia, obviously this will change and SA will catch up.

Drugs are a BIG problem here as well as teenage pregnancy and unmarried mothers of all ages is quite common, as well as disrespect for elders. I watched a program on TV a couple of weeks ago, directed at teenagers, where they were stating that the average age for kids to first experience sex here is at 11years old. My daughter went back to her friends and they discussed this in length. apparantely they agree, if you include oral sex. The majority of teenagers here are very causual about sex and experimenting with drugs, they do not seem to have any moral obligations to keep pure.

For me this was a HUGE issue and I am glad we did not make the move then. As we all know teenagers need to fit in, to be accepted by their peers and I personally know of people who are dealing with kids who are now hooked on drugs or whose daughter is also another unmarried teenager. Do not get me wrong this could happen in SA too, but immigration is difficult at the best of times and when you are a teenager it is even worse. I did not want my children in that environment during that time.

When we did the move my kids were 17yrs, 19yrs and 23yrs. All old enough to be accountable for their own actions and have already been endowed with good morals. Even now, they have free reign and come and go as they please, they often come home and tell me stories about what they have seen and they are shocked! My boys, 19 and 23, have it the hardest because the girls here cannot understand the concept of no sex before marriage and keep pressure on them the whole time.

Anyway that is a whole new thread, but for me a LSD was the best thing and I could make an informed decision based on MY concerns.

[chester]

Ag Please , There are problems here but not every kid you see is like that. Don't put them all in one heap, there are heaps of good kids out there. Mine went to highschool here (at public)& not the best private school and turned out smart hardworking kids, and no they arent nerdy kids either. Boredom is responsable for a lot of country girls getting Pregant, and few work oppertunities but city kids are generally wanting to go study or work.

Don't tell me SA Kids are .

[Guest Bronwyn]

We actually did 2 x LSD's - one in 1997 when we had a 2 year old and I was pregant, and then again 18 months ago in Dec 2005.

The idea was to try and find the right State for us. The first time we did Sydney, Blue Mountains, Wollongong, Canberra and ended up in Mebourne. We hired a motor home and drove for 3 weeks. At the end of it I was convinced I could never live here. I thought the school kids were rough and cheeky, and the people were unfriendly. I was almost in tears by the time I got on the plane, I was so homesick for South Africa. When we got home we threw away the Visa application.

18 months ago I was a lot more ready, but I have to be honest and say it was more to do with my experiences in South Africa by then, (8 years later), than anything to do with Australia.

We left the kids with granny, and flew into Perth, then Adelaide, then Melbourne. We had only one mission: to choose the right State where we would feel at home.

At the end of the day it turned out that we were State-sponsored by South Australia, so all our driving/flying around Australia didn't help much with the decision, and here we are, 5 months later.

I think the advent of the Internet in the meanwhile, this forum, and the general decline of conditions in South Africa all played a part in our change of heart. I literally felt I would rather take a chance on having my children cheeky and safe, living in Australia, than at risk every day.

I think if you can really afford the LSD go for it, but if you have made up your mind to emmigrate and you are in the right head-space, it could be money you are wasting. You can rather use the plane fare to settle in and buy a car here, etc. But you have to be sure there is a 'No going back' policy then. You have to be as sure as possible it is what you want.

Just my view.

Bronwyn

Edited April 29, 2007 by Bronwyn

[Guest colton]

Chester I didn't say all kids are like that just that those were our concerns as a family at that time and we felt better staying where we were. The topic was about whether a LSD was worth it. I was merely pointing out that a LSD is for you to come and see things as they apply to your personal circumstances. Not once did I state the kids back in RSA are only that they are more sheltered and actually have a childhood.

All that was a couple of years back when my kids were 9, 11 and 15years they are all much older now and my oldest has lived overseas for 4 years on his own, 2 years in Oz and then 2years later in Uk and now we are all happily living here back in Australia. From what I have read on this forum our family is one of the few that settled in exceptionally quickly and we have never had any doubts or misgivings Obviously a LSD was good for us because maybe we wouldn't have settled so quick back then.

If you read any of my other posts I also state that the above happens in RSA but mostly in the other cultures. In Australia it is just very obvious among the white kids. Once again to clarify it is just to point out a LSD should be for you to see things for yourself not just rely on everyone else's opinions, each family have their own personal concerns.

[chester]

Sorry point take

[Guest colton]

No problem. I just wanted to try and get the point across that Australia isn't all perfect. Alot of people come over having never left RSA before and immigration is their first step out of the country. Sometimes the mindset of people back in RSA is anything is better than at home, this isn't always the case and each family is at a different stage in their lives at various times.

I have family who are living very happily back in RSA, my parents included who could come out here in a flash but choose to stay there, and obviously that is where they are meant to be at this particular time in their lives. I just worry about people who make the move because "everyone else" is doing it. Maybe it's not the right time for them and then they are never happy here, we all know people like that.

I was just hoping to point out a different perspective to make people think about what it is they are leaving for. That is what is so good about this forum, you get to hear all different opinions. Oh and by the way we LOVE it here!!!

[Erica]

No problem. I just wanted to try and get the point across that Australia isn't all perfect. Alot of people come over having never left RSA before and immigration is their first step out of the country. Sometimes the mindset of people back in RSA is anything is better than at home, this isn't always the case and each family is at a different stage in their lives at various times.

I have family who are living very happily back in RSA, my parents included who could come out here in a flash but choose to stay there, and obviously that is where they are meant to be at this particular time in their lives. I just worry about people who make the move because "everyone else" is doing it. Maybe it's not the right time for them and then they are never happy here, we all know people like that.

I was just hoping to point out a different perspective to make people think about what it is they are leaving for. That is what is so good about this forum, you get to hear all different opinions. Oh and by the way we LOVE it here!!!

Hello Everyone

I could not agree more Colton we have for years listened to friends who are going becuase of this and that and have stood our ground - until the day we woke up and realised it was time to go . I think the most important thing in the world is to do something because it is right for yourself and your family not because it is the in thing to do - YOU WILL NEVER BE HAPPY UNDER THOSE CIRCUMSTANCES.

We are doing the LSD in August and yes we have been out of SA but only for holidays and not with thoughts of moving for life.

good to hear that Australia is not all perfect would be worried if it was - perfection is what we make it I guess . As for leaving parents behind well we dont have many parents left - MY MOM who lives with us is the hardest but all going according to plan maybe she can be with us in time and she can visit as often as she likes - she is one of those people who have been through the bad days grew up in Kenya and watched country disolve before her eyes . Pushes us daily to get her grandchildren out -

We have a teenage daughter who is precious but also headstrong - BUT - all our values and home believes have kept her strong and solid. Like anyone with a teenager there are days where you wonder if they will grow up to be stable secure members of society . But the good side is you know yourself and you know your partner and if you home is a strong and solid place your children will push and test you but will come out no matter what - stong and solid yes they may wander from the road but as parents you will be there to pull them back. Many people on this forum have commented re noticeing moms and children and family time which indicates to someone on the other end of the earth that these people have more time to spend with their children which means MORE TIME TO INSTILL THE RIGHT VALUES AND BELIEVES please correct me if I am wrong .

But drugs are everwhere. But hands on parents are not - so yes Colton is right in her outlook and most valued by members like myself she has been there and done it not easy to get 3 teenagers through to adult hood and yes to say the RSA mindset is anything is better then home is correct we are so eager to get away from the violence that we dont look any further . good to hear the truth about a place we dont know from someone who is living it and no I dont believe we are going to a drug invested world but least i go with an open eye to the reality that yes drugs do exist like they do here and i still have to remind my children not to trust everybody and everything . this is a good thing for people who dont know about a country

Thanks Colton for the honesty and making the steps towards this new place

E

[Rocky]

Hi All

I agree with Erica. Thanks for all the positive mails. It is really what we need to make this huge decisions.

Greetings

Rocky