Migrants face four-year wait to be Australian

[Danie]

Ek sien die Howard regeering is weer besig om aan die immigrasie wette te peuter...

news com

"MIGRANTS will have to wait at least four years before becoming Australian citizens under

a Federal Government proposal expected to be announced today."

D

[Guest colton]

I read about this on another forum. Does this mean, if the bill gets accepted, that to qualify for citizenship you will have to stay in Australia for 4 years, not leaving at all during that time, so that after the 4 years you will be granted citizenship? My brother took 3 years to get citizenship because after his first year we had a death in the family and he came home to sort out the will, etc and when he went back they started counting the two years for citizenship from the time he returned. The one year he had already done was null and void.

If so, that's not good news for us with elderly parents back home.

[Linda]

Are you not allowed to leave the country to visit SA? Or go on holiday to another country?

[Riekie]

They did an online poll on that issue and more than 80% (obviously aussies) supported the proposed legislation!! BAD news for us!

[Guest Lara]

I think this is only when you come over to Australia after having validated your visa then leaving Australia and not living there immediately. So if you don't come over as soon as your visa is granted but wait a couple years and then come and live in Australia then it means you have to stay here without exiting the country.

I'm sure someone else can exlain this better than I can.

Are you not allowed to leave the country to visit SA? Or go on holiday to another country?

[Guest Larry]

When it was two years, the wording was something along the lines of "two years' residence in Australia in the past five years". This meant that if you left Australia for any reason, the clock stopped ticking. - It did not reset to zero!

I have seen nothing to indicate that things will change under the four year residency rule. So if you go back to SA on holiday, time spent outside Australia will get added on to the four year period.... The same way that it has been for the two year residency period.

[Riekie]

Currently it works like this: You must be in Aus for 2 years to apply. If you go to RSA for a visit for 2 weeks, that means you have to be here for 2 years + 2 weeks - so the 2 years is not uninterrupted 2 years, you simply add the time you've been out of Australia to the 2 years. Does this make sense?

I don't know if the 4 years legislation will work on the same principle?..... I can understand that the Aussies want to increase the period as well as introduce all kinds of other criteria because there's a lot of ppl in Aus who (for instance) despise everything Aussie/Western but they get all the benefits of living in this country - a lot of them live in government housing, receiving government benefits and still criticize everything and demands all kinds of rights etc. (My opinion: if you don't like the Aussie way, why bother to come here?!) They refuse to learn English but their children have the benefit of English assistance at school paid for by the Government!! Terrorism is a huge factor to be considered so yes, to a degree, this legislation will secure the safety & protection of the born citizens of this country and is actually a good thing. Unfortunately, the "good guys" like us boertjies, will also be affected by the new legislation. (I'm sure if I had citizenship already, my vote would also have been Yes..... )

[serileen]

[. Unfortunately, the "good guys" like us boertjies, will also be affected by the new legislation.

[ExASP]

ummm...as far as I know you not only have to live in Aus...you have to have PR. So the time you get your PR from is when they start to count. The rest is like Riekie says. We visited SA for a month since we got here so we can apply for citizenship at the moment while it is still 2 years only after the 11th of November.

Also it is only up for discussion at the moment as far as i know and according to the website the changes will start on the 26th of January 2007. They wanted to change it to three years but now it is four. I have no idea how quickly they will pass that legislation through though..however if you get your application in the day before the new law takes effect you still fall under the old rules. Check www.immi.gov.au. maybe the site has updated info but this am it was still the same.

[Riekie]

[. Unfortunately, the "good guys" like us boertjies, will also be affected by the new legislation.

So why on earth would you make a statement like this , aren't the rest of us also "good guys"

Please don't anyone go on the attack I just find the statement shocking

boertjies = South Africans....... It's just a figure of speech, which I've used many times on this forum - sorry if it shocked you, as I did not think the word was insulting. I also said : the good guys LIKE (in other words, for example) us boertjies (aka South Africans), with that, not excluding anyone. (Same us: flowers LIKE roses - that does not implicate only roses are flowers, but that roses are an example of flowers.....)

[serileen]

will PM you

[Marius]

We are unfortunate collateral damage in the effort to target the ( small ) section of Australian society that this legislation is intended to calibrate to the Australian way of life and language. They cannot only target sections of society, hence the blanket rule. I think if you cannot speak English you should not get allowed in, period. Same with general Australian way of life, you must conform to general society in the shortest possible time, you can still maintain your own identity and culture outside of mainstream society, no worries. You need to be Australian first, then whatever thereafter. Not for instance South African Australian, but Australian South African - see the difference ?The best way to start integration into society is to speak the language at least, the very basic human instinct, communication. If you cannot do this,you stay excluded, the longer you cannot communicate effectively, the longer you take to fully intergrate and resentment towards you will grow as you are seen as not willing to communicate and integrate, therefore not embracing the way of life at its most basic form.

If you cannot speak English, dont bother to come. If you are already here and not willing to learn English, go live where you can speak your own language. If you dont like the Austrlain way of life, go live where you feel happy with your environment. That is why I am here, I did not like or agree with my previous environment so I changed it.

Do you have to know a bit of Australian customs and history before becoming a citizen ? - hell yes ! Speak English ? - for sure. Embrace the coutry and the way of life and be loyal to it - no doubt. Support the Wallabies-dont know

Thats how i see it as a proud fair dinkum boertjie. Klim pens en pootjie in of bly uit

Most Aussies see it the same, hence their support for the bill. We may not all agree on the method, but I think the intention is good and overdue.

[Dedrei]

There seems to be some good news in the four year wait for citizenship, seems like while you are on temp visa it can count towards it as well.

Check out http://britishexpats.com/forum/showthread.php?t=396979

Seems there is some hope after all!

[Bob]

A number of years ago, I remember South Africans being privileged migrants, along with others from the Commonwealth such as British, New Zealand and Canadian migrants.

South Africans, up to the end of 1974, could land with a one way ticket and a passport in hand, stay as long as they liked (no visa, unlike non-Commonwealth citizens), work anywhere (Australian or State gov't jobs as well as private industry), eligible to join the Australian armed forces, could vote and stand for Parliament after only 6 months' residency, could march with their Australian comrades-in-arms at Anzac Day and Remembrance Day celebrations after serving together in both World Wars, and could get Australian citizenship after just 12 months (unlike others that had between three to five years to wait).

I remember those days in the 1970's, so South Africans to me are the "good guys" that stood by Aussies in two World Wars!

I do find it shocking when others go to a country and bomb the joint, killing the people that have given them a better life and higher standard of living and freedom they wouldn't have enjoyed in their country of origin.

Do we have to elaborate anymore on who the "good guys" are?

Perhaps it's a forlorn hope, but if the Australian gov't can ask new citizens to read up and learn about Australia's history . . . the first fleet in 1788 landing convicts and free settlers, the Gold Rush days starting in Ballarat in 1851 bringing "diggers" from the Californian goldfields and England, the federation of the six colonies, the Gallipoli campaign in the middle of WW1 and the affect of bring together the different colonies to see themselves as one country . . . Australia, the 1930's depression and Sir Otto Niemeyer's statement of the Bank of England being unable to bail Australia out, the "bodyline" series in cricket, WW2 and Britain's inablility to halt the Japanese and Australia's withdrawal from North Africa to fight in New Guinea, the post war years of the the 1950's and 60's, the Vietnam War war and the dividing of the nation, the Whitlam years and the Hawke years.

Australia's history has been marked by tough times and a sense of Australians needing to pull together to see themselves through . . . . this is why Aussies have a deep longing for "mateship' and community support and are such bloody terrific team players.

Maybe there will be a growing appreciation of Australia's unique culture and the background to its people instead of anymosity towards it.

Edited September 18, 2006 by Bob

[Marius]

Bob,

"Maybe there will be a growing appreciation of Australia's unique culture and the background to its people instead of anymosity towards it."

Exactly the point, I agree

Dedrei,

Thanks, that is good news Especially since I will ( hopefully ) have PR under the RSMS scheme by end of 2006.

[Annette]

I hope that we get to have Aussie history and citizenship lessons in the process ... I for one can't wait to learn everything there is to learn about my new adoptive home! (that's in addition to our resident tutor here, Bob, of course ) We LOVE IT here and will do whatever it takes to become fully fledged Aussie South Africans (or South African Aussies, or whatever ) ...

[Linda]

Okay ... two years, four years ... does it really matter? As a permanent resident you've got the same benefits as a citizen, you are here to stay, right? So it doesn't really matter if you HAVE to stay another two years to become a citizen.

[Riekie]

will PM you

Thanks for your PM - everything's OK!

I do find it shocking when others go to a country and bomb the joint, killing the people that have given them a better life and higher standard of living and freedom they wouldn't have enjoyed in their country of origin. Do we have to elaborate anymore on who the "good guys" are?

Bob, my point exactly! If you CHOOSE to relocate to another country, you have to EMBRACE that country - not criticize, attack or judge it, while still demanding all the benefits! - NOTHING wrong in wanting to protect your country against that, and if it takes extending the period after which you may apply for citizenship, and introduce English speaking ability as a criteria, it is your RIGHT. Unfortunately ALL of us whose intentions are honest & good (whether you're a "boertjie", a Russian or a Malaysian or whatever....) will also be affected - the point I was trying to make......

I attended a citizenship ceremony last night and there were ppl from 9 different countries who were warmly welcomed and accepted as citizens of Australia. What a wonderful thing to see! Hopefully, one day, I will also be a proud South-African born Australian!!!

[ExASP]

For me personally it does matter...I cant apply for a job in the defence force and I wonder if the problem is not the time you have to wait but the exam you have to do... and a language test...again??

[Guest Noeks]

Hopefully, one day, I will also be a proud South-African born Australian!!!

My sentiments exactly. Just this morning, I attended assembly at my daughter's school, to see her receiving an award, and I was so embarassed, to the core, that I didn't know the words of the anthem. I made a conscious decision standing there this morning, that I will learn it asap, and the next time I find myself in that position, I'll be able to sing along quite merrily!!

[Queensland Girl]

Your child needs to be an Australian Citizen to benefit from the HECS/HELP scheme when they are at Uni.

This is an interest free loan tp pay for tertiary education, and only starts to be repaid once the beneficiary earns a minimum of $35 000 per annum.

[Bob]

O.K. . . . . benefits of citizenship:

Right to hold and travel on an Australian passport and come and go to and from Australia 24 / 7, 365 days a year without restriction and to obtain Australian diplomatic representation overseas when needed.

Can join the Australian Army, Royal Australian Navy or Royal Australian Air Force.

Can work for the Australian Commonwealth, State or Territory gov'ts and local gov't.

Right to vote in all public elections as an Australian citizen and the right to stand for Office (Parliament).

Ability to live in New Zealand without restriction and to come and go to and from New Zealand 24 / 7, 365 days a year.

Can obtain Australian gov't scholarship (Youth Allowance, if under 25 and Aus-study, if older) for studying at a tertiary institution (University, College, Technical and Further Education (T.A.F.E.) courses) as an Australian citizen.

There may be more and more, changing as time goes by, but this is what I can think of at the moment which non-citizens are not entitled to, even if they have permanent residency here.