Private schools in Adelaide

[FAB]

Hi,

I have done some extensive research on public schools in Adelaide, and now need some advice regarding private schools. We have narrowed down the areas to eastern and southern suburbs.

We have 3 daughters (3, 5, 7 this year) and I would appreciate it if someone could shed some light about the following issues:

1) As they have no brothers, is it better to put them in a co-ed school where they will have some exposure to boys or a girls only school where they will be taught in ways that are customised for girls (I read somewhere teaching methods for girls and boys differ)? What I am concerned about is that they might later see boys as these mysterious creatures (I know some will probably say they ARE, especially during teenage years ) and put them on a "pedestal" and not know how to interact with them if you know what I mean. I would like for them to be comfortable around boys and have a life (sport, culture, hobbies etc) and not thinking about boys the whole time...

2) Which type of school (Anglican, Catholic or Uniting) are most like Christian values? I think Anglican, then Uniting and then Catholic?

3) Does anyone have any inside info (which of them has the best reputation, maybe even rank them) on the following schools in Adelaide:

(There are only 3 schools in Adelaide which are accredited by the Council of International Schools (CIS))

3.1 Mercedes College in Fullarton Road, SPRINGFIELD (Co-ed Catholic school with 1230 students, Accredited by CIS)

3.2 Woodcroft College in MORPHETT VALE (Co-ed Anglican school with 1340 students, Accredited by CIS)

3.3 St Peter's Collegiate Girls' School in STONYFELL (Girls only Anglican school with 500 students, Accredited by CIS)

3.4 Annesley College in Greenhill Road, WAYVILLE (Girls only Uniting school with 550 students, NOT accredited)

3.5 Seymour College in GLEN OSMOND (Girls only Uniting school with 650 students, NOT accredited)

4. Any other private schools that I have not included that you think we should consider?

We are coming over on our visa activation trip to Adelaide and have already organised some school visits with most of the above schools. One even has a visitors day where our two oldest daughters (they are very excited ) will spend the day in school with 2 current students.

I am looking forward to some great responses.

FAB

[Dax]

The only private school that i have inside info on and that i would reccommend is Our Saviour Lutheran in Aberfoyle Park.

Google them, they should be on the www.

Cheers,

Dax

[Kalla & Nanette]

Hi Fab

We have enrolled our son in St Mark's Lutheran School (in the Hills) for next year. We had friends there and their kids were very happy. I suggest looking at Lutheran schools too, as Dax suggested. The Christian values are also important (I think a lot like methodist etc.)

Just a suggestion.

[MannyT]

Hi FAB

I can relate to your dilemma as I had three boys, so after a couple of years at La Salle College (bad mistake) it was co-ed from then onwards for all three of them. They loved it and I am all for co-ed schools. Hey if I had three girls I may have considered sending them to girls only schools, as day scholars

I have visited Mercedes College on a number of occasions and think that it is a great school. Neighbour has two sons who go there and they are exceptionally well mannered boys.

Catholic, co-ed, primary and high school. reasonably priced for a private school- approx $6000 per annum, with discounts for additional children enrolled. Great area. Bronwyn has just enrolled her daughter to go there from the beginning of 2009.

I have visited Seymor College on a number of occasions and the school has large grounds and great facilities. Historically PGH (Presbyterian Girls High), girls only, primary and high school. I do not know cost per annum. great area. One of the better private girl's schools in Adelaide. great reputation.

Pembroke on, The Parade, located just up from Norwood. co-ed, expensive, about $15 000 per annum. nice area. Large grounds and good facilities.

Walford apparently also a very good private girls school. Friend's daughters went there, but I have not personally visited the school.

I have driven past St Peters Collegiate Girls School in Stonyfell but have no personal knowledge of the school. Lovely established older area with the school set amongst the trees.

There are a number of other private schools in your preferred area with good reputations (in addition to the one's that you mentioned) that you could consider once you get here, eg. Scott College . By the way Morphett Vale is quite far south of Adelaide.

Enjoy!

Manny

Edited February 20, 2008 by MannyT

[Annette]

Hi FAB

I'll answer the question as objectively as I can. I have to first off say though that I have an ideological problem with a two-tier education system for a myriad of different reasons. However, I'll never judge anyone who sends their their kids to private school and there are many circumstances where I would have to put ideology aside should the need arise and consider private school education for my own son. My father and older brothers attended a very prestigious anglican school in Cape Town. I also work at a private school and I have some insight into how things operate in such a place and in some of the schools you mentioned. Why do I tell you all this? Because I think people who ask for this kind of advice / recommendation on a forum can be so vulnerable to all kinds of advice without knowing the first thing about the person giving the advice. It would be so easy to jump on the first and best piece of advice that sounds sensible, while there is just no way of knowing where the person giving the advice is coming from. They may be a complete moron, who makes emotional decisions based on the most tenuous of gossip or info, or may have some sort of alterior motive etc. You just don't know! I think you are sensible enough to all the different opinions, file them away for future reference and then come and see for yourself, visit as many schools as you can and make up your own mind. There is also a lot to be said for 'gut instinct'. Try and visit schools unannounced if possible and have a list of questions ready which will give you the information you really feel is important.

So, now that that's out of the way, please note that the following is my opinion only and there may be those who disagree. I have strong opinions on things and I don't mind expressing them :

1. Co-ed or no co-ed? My personal opinion is that it wuold be best to put them in a co-ed school, especially as they don't have any brothers. There ARE different ways of teaching girls and boys if you want them to perform at their best academically, yes. However I am very strongly of the opinion that academic results are overrated and that a good education is one that makes a person a useful, well-adapted and fulfilled member of society. That encompassed a whole range of skills and experiences which lead to the forming of a well-rounded person. Does the school encourage community involvement? Do kids learn social and communication skills as much as how to achieve the highest test scores? Having said that, don't stress too much if you do decide on a girls' only school. All of the single sex schools have close ties to a "brother" or "sister" school and they will often have music tours together, or tkae part in joint drama productions, mooting competitions, dance classes, whatever.

2. All of the schools you mention are founded on Christian principles and values. There are many different Christian denominations. I assume though that you mean something approximating Protestant, Reformed Christian values like we knew in the NG Kerk? I would say the Lutheran, Uniting or Baptist churches would be closest. You have to be aware though that all of the private schools in Adelaide are church schools in name. Being a "church" school in name does not however mean that kids who attend these schools (or even their parents )are angelic or even that they are regular churchgoers. Staff do not necessarily have to be Christians either, although there are some schools which very vehemently apply the principle of employing regular churchgoers of their denomination only. The Baptist and Lutheran schools tend to be more in this vein. I am of the opinion that this sometimes makes academic standards suffer. There are those "church" schools which are only Christian because of historical or traditional reasons. Kids will attend chapel every week, and that's just about where it will end. Anglican schools, I'm afraid, are the worst culprits IMHO. The very most prestigious (read snobbish) schools will take virtually anyone who will pay (even better if they can bequeath a substantial portion of their cash to the school in their will) and if you can make their orchestra / hockey team / exam results look good, they wil be very keen on signing you up. There are those schools at the other end of the spectrum which profess to be Christian in every aspect of their being, but often display some of the most intolerant, unchristian behaviour I have ever heard of. I have two friends who have moved their children from such a school because of the appalling attitudes and silly petty things that they attach disproportionate value to. None of these schools are on your list though, so I'll leave that there. I should perhaps mention here that I am a practising, committed Christian so please don't think I have something against Christian schools. I have just bcome a little cynical with the way some of these establishments conduct themselves and portray Christ-like values to the wider community. It can be cringeworthy and very damaging to Christianity in my opinion.

3. There are 12 schools accredited by the CIS in Adelaide, but only 3 include primary schools. You should also be looking at IB schools, an arguably more rigorous program of accreditation. It is rare for a school to offer the IB programme in primary years though. Woodcroft is one that does, I see.

I would not recommend St Peter's girls. I know a bit about Seymour and Annesley. Both are prestigious and would lead to many good contacts for later life "old school ties" use. They are well regarded academically. Watch out for snobbish "you are not one of us" attitudes though. They are likely to score rich husbands if they attend there though, which can't be a bad thing I would probably choose Seymour if it was me. Ask Bronwyn about Mercedes. I don't know much about it.

I would strongly recommend that you also look at Pembroke school: http://www.pembroke.sa.edu.au/index.php

I have regular dealings with them and I have always been very impressed with how the school is run, the facilities and their ethical conduct. I like the way they treat their staff as well, and that always says something about a school.

A few parting words: Be very very careful when choosing a private school and keep in mind that they will often go to great lengths to recruit another potential student. remember that every student means more dollars in the bank for the school and some schools will roll out the red carpet to impress around every corner. Some of the private schools you have mentioned have substantial marketing and recruitment budgets and staff dedicated to this purpose. They are professionals and are employed to convince you to choose their school. Go into there with your eyes open and your wits about you. I would be extremely wary of the school which throws their matric results at you at the first opportunity. Remember that a school where 60% or more of the parents are doctors, lawers or investment bankers are obviously going to have a very good gene pool. Good academic results do not necessarily equate to excellent teaching. A significant number of private school parents pay for private one-on-one tutoring and summer schools for their kids. I have to ask myself why they feel this is necessary. Competitiveness can be very very significant in some of these schools - another thing to watch for. There are parents who will do anything to lead their little darlings (and by proxy themselves) to greater glory...

I don't know whether that was a great response, but I hope it will at least make you think.

[Annette]

FAB,

I realised today that I can't believe I didn't mention the Wilderness school yesterday when I posted.

If you do decide on a girls' school, you would do well to consider them. I have regular dealings with staff at "Wildy" and they are such lovely people. It is an excellent school. Very exclusive, but also very warm, homely and friendly. I have a real soft spot for the school.

I am a huge fan of the Madeleine books and the girls in their straw boaters and little pinafores look like they have walked straight out of one of the books.

Really caring people, really good standards and well-mannered pupils.

Once again, a warning - watch out for the snobs though

Edited February 20, 2008 by Annette

[MannyT]

Hi

If you are interested in Pembroke, a South African aquaitance (Graham Duffy,ex Cape Town) of ours teachers there.

You could meet with him when you move to Adelaide, if you like.

Enjoy!

Manny

[FAB]

Hi there again,

Thanks for all who replied (and via PM) for your advice and honesty - I appreciate it.

After many hours of late night researching the issue we eventually decided it would be best for our situation to have the girls (2, 5, 7) attend a co-ed school. Therefore, even though we encountered many excellent girls-only schools, all of them are disqualified in our case.

We are also not looking at any Catholic or Anglican schools (too different to what we're used to as Christians)

The closest would probably be Christian, Baptist or Lutheran schools. We could not find any Baptist schools in eastern Adelaide (I know there are quite a few in Perth, though).

We still have not made up our minds about public or private and we have shortlisted the following schools in the eastern parts of Adelaide (in no particular order of preference) to visit during our trip:

Private:

Pembroke

Scotch College

Sunrise Christian School (Fullarton Campus)

Woodcroft College

Public:

Burnside Primary

Stirling East Primary

Linden Park Primary

We would really value your comments on any of the above schools.

THEN...

Other schools which we discovered (through our research, and NOT via personal reference) are the following. We would highly appreciate any comments regarding these as well.

Private:

St John's Lutheran in Highgate (they are the junior school associated with Concordia College)

Westminister Uniting School in Marion

Bethesda Christian College

Public:

Crafers Primary (in the Hills)

Magill School (not sure about the quality of the area)

Norwood Primary

North Adelaide Primary

Looking forward to some more valuable opinions.

Looking more forward to our trip

FAB

[Andrea]

We are also not looking at any Catholic or Anglican schools (too different to what we're used to as Christians)

The closest would probably be Christian, Baptist or Lutheran schools. We could not find any Baptist schools in eastern Adelaide (I know there are quite a few in Perth, though).

FAB

Hi FAB, I'm sure you didn't mean it quite the way it came out, BUT Catholics and Anglicans are Christians too

All the schools you listed are good schools, you have proberly noticed by now that you are spoilt for choice, which is what makes the choice so much more difficult .

[Guest Bronwyn]

Hi Antoin

Just a quick one for now, as I have to pop out. We attended a parent's meeting at Burnside the other night where we were told Burnside Primary is phasing in IB (International Baccalaureate - sp? ) into the school, as of now. I believe it will be the first public primary school in Adelaide to teach an IB syllabus. You can phone the headmaster, Frank Mittiga, if you want more info.

I also have heard you should stay away from St. Peter's unfortunately, but I don't know why this is so.

Bye 4 now,

Bronwyn

Edited March 18, 2008 by Bronwyn

[Guest Bronwyn]

Hmmm let's see. We had the same dilemma, and then decided we would go Public at least for the first year or two while we were still renting, and then make a call about Private/Public once we had bought a house and knew where we stood finance-wise. It is just so hard to research from far away.

Private:

Pembroke - Fantastic reputation but $15k per annum in high school, x three kids, is a serious amount of money. My friend has a daughter there who is doing exceptionally well, but camps, sports, etc. are all on top of the fees. She says it is draining them financially, and she is sorry she chose it. They get up at 4am on a Sunday to go to rowing lessons. You will have to budget $50k per annum for this, because once you put your girls there, you can't easily change your minds and pull them out. This is a very serious amount of after-tax money. But if it's no object then go for it, there is no doubt it's a great school.

Scotch College - There is a lot of backstabbing and 'skinner' in ADL about schools and a birdy told me they have problems. But that was a Seymour College birdie, so who knows what to believe? They have a nice uniform. Other than that I know nothing about them.

Sunrise Christian School (Fullarton Campus) - I don't know anything about this school. I would set up a meeting with them while you are here.

Woodcroft College - Ditto above

Public:

Burnside Primary - As you know this is where we ended up. Very ugly uniform, but the school reminds me of my own Primary School in 1970's suburbia. Same feel. They seem to care quite a bit about the kids. It's a bonus because it's only a few hundred dollars per year, but you must be in the school catchment to get in, and the rental in the area is going to be over $400 per week.To buy, $600k plus. I can refer you to a South African Estate Agent who can find you a house there if you like.

Stirling East Primary - This was our other top choice. Lovely school in a beautiful area. Nice lady principal. Also very strict catchment area. Our problem was that we were also looking at high schools (12 year old) and there were none in the area. Because yours are younger this won't be such an issue. Rent in the area also well over $400 pw. To buy, $650k plus. Stirling can be a bit far from town/work on a bad weather day, but it really is stunning up there. Sometimes the highway mists over and they drop the speed limit. If you end up working in the North you could drive for an hour each way...

Linden Park Primary - Didn't investigate the school for some reason. Probably good. On the downside, it's also expensive to live in catchment though.

Private:

St John's Lutheran in Highgate (they are the junior school associated with Concordia College)

Westminister Uniting School in Marion

Bethesda Christian College

I don't know these schools at all but Marion is not exactly a pretty area. Good shopping Centre, though.

Public:

Crafers Primary (in the Hills) - Also pretty and a slightly less expensive area than Stirling, but most houses in the catchment are on EXTREMELY steep blocks. It is offputting as you often can not even walk in the garden. Ones we went to were like cliffs. We met the headmaster and he was wierd. It put us off.

Magill School (not sure about the quality of the area) - At first glance you think it's not a great area, but it is actually very popular and quite expensive as it's on the bus route to town. Lots of subdivision has happened already. Might be convenient to your line of work. Very central. Very large school, headmistress we met was completely frazzled. Your average block size here will be small, say 400sqm. Houses $350 per week or to buy $550k plus. It's unlikely you will find something big enough, I know you said you want a big block.

Norwood Primary - For some reason we missed this one completely, but I think it has a very tiny catchment and there were no rentals when we looked.

North Adelaide Primary - DH loves N. Adl. We did go see the school. I think there were no walls, we wondered why the kids don't simply walk away...?The problem is that you can rent there ok, but when you want to buy the houses are up in the millions. More Lamborghinis registered in N. Adl than anywhere else in the city. We decided it was no use starting something we were unlikely to finish.

Sjoe my hands are tired now! It's a pity you are not looking at Anglican, because I also liked the look of St. John's Grammar in Belair, and there you might still be able to get the block size you want, although they have had a huge price jump in the past 12 months.

If you like we can chat more when you are here in the next few weeks. Hope it helps!

Regards, Bronwyn

Edited March 18, 2008 by Bronwyn

[Annette]

Hi Antoin

Just a quick one for now, as I have to pop out. We attended a parent's meeting at Burnside the other night where we were told Burnside Primary is phasing in IB (International Baccalaureate - sp? ) into the school, as of now. I believe it will be the first public primary school in Adelaide to teach an IB syllabus. You can phone the headmaster, Frank Mittiga, if you want more info.

I also have heard you should stay away from St. Peter's unfortunately, but I don't know why this is so.

Bye 4 now,

Bronwyn

Ahem.... not quite Bronwyn. Blackwood Primary where my son went has been teaching the IB middle years syllabus for a few years now, as have all of the schools in the Mitcham Hills. They are all currently candidate schools for the Primary years program, like Burnside. Here is a list of of public schools which offer the IB programs in Australia: http://www.ibo.org/school/search/index.cfm...nd_schools=Find

Unfortunately it's not possible to sort according to primary and high schools, because the middle years programs actually cover years 6 to 10. Primary years programs cover years 1 to 5. Also, you can't sort according to state, but you'll see that most of them are in SA. Did you know that South Australia had the most IB schools in Australia and that Adelaide is the city which has the highest number of state schools offering the IB program?

Linden Park and Stradbroke in Rostrevor already offer the primary years programs, while there are a lot that offer the middle years program.

Antoin, Bronwyn has given some excellent views on the schools she visited. I can only add the following: Westminster has an excellent reputation. It is certainly worth considering in my opinion. Woodcroft is also a great school and the two people I know with children there are extremely happy (as are their kids).

Now, I hate having to say this, because I am a committed Christian and feel so sad to have to make a statement like this, but be careful of some of the Christian colleges. They can be a bit skewed in their view of the world and in my opinion potentially do not adequately prepare kids for the real world. Academic standards are more often not important and staff are firstly and almost exclusively vetted on whether they are regular churchgoers with not much investigation at all into whether they can actually teach. Now, I know that can be very important to people. I have just unfortunately had experience with at least 3 people who have withdrawn their kids from them because of various issues (and the children actually displaying some signs of psychological damage / trauma). I have myself applied for a job at one of them and couldn't get out fast enough. I also know teachers who are not at all happy with the way their schools are run. It's hard to put into words what my concerns exactly are, but the best way is to say in Afrikaans - hulle is geneig om baie dweperig te wees en baie onverdraagsaam en afgesny van die wereld. To often I have seen extremely unchristian attitudes associated with some of the Christian colleges and a teenager told me a few months ago how much pressure there was from the school he attended to go into a religious direction - missionary, theology, etc. and that he felt quite judged and rejected when he chose to attend a regular university and study a "worldly" degree. It breaks my heart, but I have been wanting to say something for some time, because I see one South African family after the other (especially Afrikaans ones) heading for these schools only to be very sorry later. Others actually fit in well. I'm happy for them, but go into it with your eyes open.

Look, you are intelligent people and obviously love our kids very much. You also seem to have the right attitudes to childrearing. My suggestion would be to make lots of appointments at the schools that are in the areas that you feel most at home (so, a lot of driving wais for you! ) and go with your gut instinct. What feels right. Take the kids and see what they think. Often kids are much more perceptive than us adults and ultimately they have to feel comfortable and happy with where they end up.

Edited March 18, 2008 by Annette

[Guest Bronwyn]

Ahem.... not quite Bronwyn. Blackwood Primary where my son went has been teaching the IB middle years syllabus for a few years now, as have all of the schools in the Mitcham Hills. They are all currently candidate schools for the Primary years program, like Burnside.

Hi there

Seems I misunderstood, sorry (Maybe they were referring to the junior years? Not sure)...! I'm glad I was corrected before I told more people the wrong thing, thanks!

Bronwyn

[Annette]

Sorry, I wasn't trying to be a smart alec

[Bob]

It seems that we're only talking largely about the "well heeled" private schools in Adelaide.

If you're just considering yourselves to be common ol' garden variety folk, you might like to consider a local Church school to send your kids off to.

You won't have to sell one of your kids into slavery to help pay the tuition fees at these schools as they are supposed to be "affordable" for people worshipping in the parish to send their kids to.

The Church groups that operate schools in South Australia are mainly:

Lutheran Church of Australia

http://www.lea.org.au/public/content/ViewCategory.aspx?id=5

Anglican Church

http://www.aasn.edu.au/south_australia.cfm

Catholic Church

http://web.ceo.adl.catholic.edu.au/Schools/Schools.asp

Independent Christian Parent-Controlled Schools (Reformed background)

http://www.cpcs.edu.au/schools/south_australia.cfm

There are other groups operating schools in South Australia, such as Montessori and Rudolf Steiner schools, but the ones listed are by far the major umbrella groups here.

My son and youngest daughter both went to High School at Cornerstone College, here in the Adelaide Hills. . . fees around $4 000 a year

My son won the runner-up Australian Apprentice of the Year (against 400 000 applicants)

My daughter was offered a place to study Medicine this year, but declined to continue studying Occupational Therapy.

http://www.cornerstonecollege.sa.edu.au/

As far as your children are concerned, the world is their oyster in Australia.