"Stop Being Pedantic!"

[jpokennedy]

This thread just confirmed to me again the reason why I would never ask for advice on this site!!!

[Mara]

It is also the reason why, as hosts, we ask people to take a deep breath, before they decide to "give newcomers a taste of reality". Until you know the whole story, you cannot really give them "your reality", all you can do is try and assist. After all, they are having enough up hill as it is, bashing them about the head is not going to assist in any way.

I think the biggest problem for SmellyN is that they are looking in a pretty limited area, which also unfortunately, is a holiday destination and the Christmas break is upon us!

SmellyN, I sincerely hope that you manage to find a good outcome, that will work for you and your family in the immediate future!

[Toitjie]

Hi Smelly - I hope you get your rental soon! I think most of us have had a few bad experiences but I just changed to another agent and the ones helping me now are brilliant, they are kind, talk to me like a friend and could not be more helpful. People are the same everywhere. You get rude ones and friendly ones in every country. Sorry that you had to go through this, as someone else said, we go through immense sacrifice to get there...and the stress is awful. good luck with everything!

[mittwelt]

Sending as much positive energy that I can muster!!! It must be absolutely horrific. Thinking of you so much.

[Bams]

Lots have been said here to and from SmellyN, so all I will say is that I am praying for you SmellyN and sending you lots of hugs.

[ronfire]

Sounds like an agent who's not making her targets and was taking her frustration out on you.

I really hope you can find something suitable soon. It doesn't help being in a small town like that. I would concur with a couple of comments suggesting putting some things into storage for a bit, but in the end you need to do what's best for your family.

For what it's worth, you will get through this, and things will get better. You've done the huge part of moving countries, no - continents! After all that, what can a lowlife with delusions of grandeur do to you?

All the best as you continue searching!

Not to pry, but what is your budget for a house?

Unfortunately the style of the master bedroom being at the opposite end of the house to the kids bedrooms is the Aussie norm. As a parent of a small children, this has to be the stupidiest design option I have ever encountered. Whoever thought it up should be shot. But then this is Australia and every single house I have been in has that design. At least in WA.

Sorry, not trying to hijack the thread, but I thought I was the only one who had this exact opinion about master bedroom designs in WA but voicing it usually invites plenty of defensive feedback and comments of "well, if you don't like it, you can leave" (Not here on this forum!) so I've usually kept quiet.

Glad to know others feel the same way!

[SmellyN]

Said agent is actually a matronly "old hand" & knows the area pretty well & does actually weirdly enough grasp the concept of what we are trying o do, she is just pushing it to her advantage of course- it is a small town so competition would be tough- there are too many agents here! On another note, by trying not to throw all my eggs in one basket today I did call another agent or too (again) I was SHOCKED to have the phone deliberately thrown down in my ear after I "dared" to mention I was promised a call back from the dealer/agent principle to discuss a different direction through the sale option-houses rather than the rentals...to which end I found myself talking to a dead line after said women put phone down with a definite "click"! Called back immediately & asked politely if there was anything wrong with the connection & asked specifically to speak to the principle rather than explain everything all over (said principle I had actually met face to face already)- another woman answered & fired off to me how dare I "threaten" staff!!! -HUHHHUUUUHHH????? WHERE DID THIS COME FROM?! -2 women who's names I know from the calls, whom I've never met or dealt with are blatantly (quite clearly) blocking me & are now FABRICATING a story/s!!! OMIWORD!!! I told the woman that I apologise that if anything might've seemed threatening it was merely our distress & the "threat" portion was actually more going to be on our shoulders as in sitting without a place to live over Christmas, so I asked her what on earth was going on & why was everyone giving US the run-around (remember we've been working on this thing individually & together) to which answer I got again...."It's not going to change- there's nothing available" -so I ask then why are you ADVERTISING unit "xyz"(for example)? Both on yr estate board which I've seen on the streetwalk this morning, in the windows, on the websites & on the accommodation website the bookings are clear for the next 6mths at least????" -I HAVE DONE MY RESEARCH LADY!!! (I thought!! in my head)...so SHE chips back..."THERE'S NOTHING HERE TO SUIT YOU!!" -I call it quits -I've HAD enough!! So I have now officially laid my complaint & compliments to the Real Estate Licensing Resolution Board, to please do something about it for future, because this is just UNDESCRIBABLY RIDICULOUS & UNETHICAL on all fronts! My words were something along the lines of "these people should be hung for the type of business they are doing!" Anyway, said gentlemen concurred & had taken my (detailed) complaints & compliments & revealed that I am not the only person who has had such complaint into this specific area...(that made me feel less like I was the crazy person for once at least!) The sad thing is as he had discussed with his college it was a difficult case to approach...how do inadvertently "force" someone to give you a house...so long story short upon a couple of suggestions on how-abouts to unearth this evil here they will be doing an extended Longer-term, broader investigation probing from all angles to see where the real-estate ethics are being bent out of line & the laws not being followed in particular to false advertising etc. Not cool. I HATE things like this.

To this end we still don't know what we are going to do....at least found out today that the container is going to be at least 1 wk late because of shipping alone..but this could actually complicate the timing. Here's to hoping & praying that first grumpy agent that started the "pedantic" thing pulls through at least with the wisdom of her years & experience & pulls out an (affordable) hat-trick for us thing weekend!

[AndreR]

Wow SmellyN, good luck this weekend. Doing things the Aussie way is like navigating a minefield. Theres no directions and you have to prod and feel you way around. The only feedback you get is when it blows up in your face. I found that was the case applying for jobs and now applying for a house. From what I've seen at work, the Aussies are VERY sensitive to confrontation, even if it is perceived. The most difficult part of my job is dealing with the people. At least I have a kiwi colleague who shares my sentiments, so its not just me being unreasonable.

This weekend will be my third of house hunting, having had a dismal experience till now. I've followed all the instructions on the tin(this forum), and have been nothing but respectfull and polite to all I've dealt with, even trying to emphasize my fear at being homeless when my family arrives in December. It just doesn't seem to mean anything to them.

Heres to a positive weekend of house hunting.

[Jordy]

From what I've seen at work, the Aussies are VERY sensitive to confrontation, even if it is perceived. The most difficult part of my job is dealing with the people. At least I have a kiwi colleague who shares my sentiments, so its not just me being unreasonable.

The other thing that South Africans must be aware of is the Aussie use of the word "abuse". Australian usage of the word "abuse" is very wide and covers a range of behaviour from rudeness to raising your voice in an argument, whereas South Africans use the word to describe a far more gross and serious, unbecoming behaviour, often sexual in nature. So for example, in Australia, if someone is confrontational or even rude or speaks loudly in frustration on the phone to an Aussie, they will say, "The person abused me!"

When I first heard this I thought to myself, "Geez thats an over exageration of what the person did." But as AndreR says, Aussies are very sensitive to confrontation, even if it is perceived. So in SmellyN's case above the real estate agents may have (I dont know - just guessing) accused her of abusing them, to which she would have been highly insulted that she was being accused of such an indecent act. (I am just hypothesising here). The point is that the two cultures have a different understanding of what constitutes "abuse".

[AndreaL]

Andre R, I'm sure you have worked out that you can catch more flies with sugar than vinegar..........lol

The trick is to get them on-side. Renting houses isn't hard work here, they practically rent themselves, so you are just another face...............but make yourself memorable. Go into the agencies personally and strike up a conversation with the lady at the desk.

Ask her what day the new list of rentals comes out and make sure you get it straight away......charm her.............flirt a little if necessary ( no maybe not, but you get my drift, super friendly and interested in what she has to say)

If you sense she is thawing and think it might work, try the sympathy card..............tell her about the family arriving, mention the kids and how excited they are about coming to Australia.......................she probably has kids and now you have something in common.............bingo......you're in........gush a little about how lovely and friendly you have found the people, say something really nice about Australia..................remember, sugar, not vinegar.

If you do manage to annoy someone, try some damage control. Sadly, the fact is that if you annoy an Australian, they will most likely go out of their way to not help you, also what Jordy says is very true...............someone getting in your face just isn't done and evokes an enormous sense of outrage.

[AndreaL]

SmellyN

I think that unfortunately things have gone really wrong for you, which is not a very nice first impression of Australia. I do hope that grumpy (pedantic) lady comes through for you.

The thing is especially in smaller towns, everyone knows everyone else and all it takes is for you to be having a grumpy day yourself and soon everyone knows about "that grumpy South African lady". Trust me, I've made that mistake myself and had to back-pedal and do some hard yards to make it right.

So, I'm not making any smart remarks here, but you may need to change your approach a little just to get some results.

Keeping fingers crossed that matronly lady comes through for you, it sounds as though you have her on side and that is what you need right now, someone batting for you

[McCabes]

Gosh Smelly...

I really hope the experienced lady can pull something out of the woodwork for you!

Also wanted to say: I appreciate reading all the different opinions, and I think Smelly handled the feedback really well. I think it's helpful to get different viewpoints and know how people see things, both parties are right in their own ways, but stuff doesn't always apply to all people.

Good luck with everything Smelly!

[AndreaL]

You are a real sweetie McCabes

It's not about a right or wrong viewpoint..............it's about getting this family a roof over their heads, gosh there is nothing worse than being into December and not having a rental.........I've been there and done that......we moved into our first rental on New Years Eve, with a TV, rug and mattress,,.....................*shudder*

I can understand why SmellyN is sooo frustrated, but really want to help get a good result..........after all that is the only thing that counts.

So please consider my above as a mission plan, rather than anything else........................ply them with your charm SmellyN. I think that South African people in general have to deal with a wider range of personalities than Australians have come into contact with, so we have the toolbox and just have to work out which tool to use on whom.

[McCabes]

hmmm Andrea - sorry that's a good point.

So maybe I shour rather have said both sides have good points - I think we all need to be realistic about our expectations, but I think Smelly has a good point in that they have already negotiated and compromised and are taking a stand on this point. We all have our limit, and the point where we sy, "tot hier toe, en niks verder nie". It's good to see both sides.

[Nev]

What i have found with the 2 times we have gone through the rental story in the last 2 years, there seem to be a lot more people looking for the good houses than there are good houses,

The simple result of this is the renter has to bow and scrape a little to get the agent on their side as otherwise they will get a lot of rejections, especially if you are already starting with a penalty of no history renting (That they are going to be able to check) and no long term job history.

Got to say I miss being able to call the agent to show me a place then saying "Ok, i want it" and that was it, done deal if your credit check comes back ok.

[followmylead]

Hi SmellyN. Keep thinking of you and your dilemma - especially with coping with all the stress and having 3 little kids to care for as well.

Just wanted you to know we are praying and rooting for you.

[AndreR]

Today is the day. I scrubbed up real good this morning, listerined and practised my wink in the mirror. Now for the long bus trek to Parramatta to fetch my car rental and a non stop schedule of house inspections. At least the agents are getting to know me by now, as that pesky South African who hopefully they just cant wait to shut up by giving him a house.

[Mara]

Oh AndreR, loved your description, gave me a great morning chuckle...

Good luck with the house hunting, may you be blessed and get exactly what you are looking for!

[HansaPlease]

Good luck Andre... Get that house.

[SmellyN]

The other thing that South Africans must be aware of is the Aussie use of the word "abuse". Australian usage of the word "abuse" is very wide and covers a range of behaviour from rudeness to raising your voice in an argument, whereas South Africans use the word to describe a far more gross and serious, unbecoming behaviour, often sexual in nature. So for example, in Australia, if someone is confrontational or even rude or speaks loudly in frustration on the phone to an Aussie, they will say, "The person abused me!"

When I first heard this I thought to myself, "Geez thats an over exageration of what the person did." But as AndreR says, Aussies are very sensitive to confrontation, even if it is perceived. So in SmellyN's case above the real estate agents may have (I dont know - just guessing) accused her of abusing them, to which she would have been highly insulted that she was being accused of such an indecent act. (I am just hypothesising here). The point is that the two cultures have a different understanding of what constitutes "abuse".

LOL! -The WORD WAS "THREATENED"!! Not "Abuse"! I have picked up on the extra sensitivity....hence I have avoid all forms from the start, by being aware of this. I might be "abusing" them with my multiple phonecalls & visits, because I think I've covered almost all of their listings!

SmellyN

I think that unfortunately things have gone really wrong for you, which is not a very nice first impression of Australia. I do hope that grumpy (pedantic) lady comes through for you.

The thing is especially in smaller towns, everyone knows everyone else and all it takes is for you to be having a grumpy day yourself and soon everyone knows about "that grumpy South African lady". Trust me, I've made that mistake myself and had to back-pedal and do some hard yards to make it right.

So, I'm not making any smart remarks here, but you may need to change your approach a little just to get some results.

Keeping fingers crossed that matronly lady comes through for you, it sounds as though you have her on side and that is what you need right now, someone batting for you

As to backpedaling - I think we found that out in the first week meeting them all...If Grumpy Pedantic Lady can understand, I can't understand why anyone else doesn't....

What i have found with the 2 times we have gone through the rental story in the last 2 years, there seem to be a lot more people looking for the good houses than there are good houses,

The simple result of this is the renter has to bow and scrape a little to get the agent on their side as otherwise they will get a lot of rejections, especially if you are already starting with a penalty of no history renting (That they are going to be able to check) and no long term job history.

Got to say I miss being able to call the agent to show me a place then saying "Ok, i want it" and that was it, done deal if your credit check comes back ok.

Yeah the only problem here is as Mara pointed out for me before is that this area & surrounds is pretty limited with this time of the year with the Tourism etc...there is NO middleground from the agent's point of view...(99% of the time) You either find an overpriced luxury (cinema-roomed) house or an overpriced hovel (mouldy beach shack)

[SmellyN]

so to everyone helping out with their opinions -thank you! & to those of us settling in the BEST OF LUCK & WISHES in ALL MATTERS! We are sending out the "Secret Weapon" this morning too.... .......MY HUSBAND !!

He TOO has "spat & polished" himself to the 10th degree...anything cleaner & I could court him all over again & marry him again!

We discussed things over the last week too that me having & /dragging the kiddies in tow everytime is maybe not as "professional" as THIS CROWD like & the fact that our 4mth old son drool's on my sleeve & pooping/peeing in his nappy ; our 3 yr old is crawling like a dog on the floor & our 8yr old is as fidgety as a monkey, half-way on the floor & half-way off, because she's bored out of her mind -all while I am talking to them ....This crowd are the "hoy-poloy" The proverbial "brood-krummel wat brood wil wees"....it might all be too much & "offend" their sensitivities!

Anyway so we will send out the "Haan Onder die Henne" (for most of them are all "business"women...we've discussed this point too sometimes between us we've found that for natural ways hubby has a knack of communicating with women & I with men...maybe I'm "threatening" to them in that I KNOW about the way they do things because of the business background & acumen...that (common experience) doesn't change across an ocean...LOL!- It CAN'T be my LOOKS that ...I'm too "plain Jane" to be a "threat"....my whole lifetime's make-up cost would probably amount to the cost of their one pair of shoes for the day!

Oh Well! Here's to a chirpier (resigned, albeit feeling pretty defeated/depressed/ & a lot of unknown feelings in this of not belonging anywhere) -self for the day...I have the cleaning of the unit to look forward to for the day & some good home cooking with limited cooking utensils, so will have to work my magic (without the low-salt alternatives again! ) & take a "chill-pill" for the day & make my husband's return home welcoming after he is more than likely going to be stressed out beyond words again with this today (& the poor bugger on his rest day/day off after a hard week of work again)....

Going to stick it out of my mind about the Grumpy-Pedantic-Lady's dealings today & hope that she has some news for us by tomorrow/ Monday at least...but because time is short (& her options are more than likely going to be very expensive still) we are still beating on the drums to call up a more suitable (last-minute) housing option... .it doesn't help to place all your bets on one horse -there's still too much at stake here for us with the kids welfare.

I Know I sound pretty harsh from my posts, but I really am not being that way to people...if at all I am venting more here on these posts/site with & about my frustrations that I actually do with them...that's why it's so hard to go out there everyday & put on a brave face & think like the day is just peachy, when your very existence is in & around you, in total crises-chaos. ..... & you can't say a word to anyone you see everyday

Hope you all have a magic day! & thank-you all again!

[AndreaL]

I Know I sound pretty harsh from my posts, but I really am not being that way to people...if at all I am venting more here on these posts/site with & about my frustrations that I actually do with them...that's why it's so hard to go out there everyday & put on a brave face & think like the day is just peachy, when your very existence is in & around you, in total crises-chaos. ..... & you can't say a word to anyone you see everyday

Hope you all have a magic day! & thank-you all again!

Actually, it is this last post where I have realised how hysterical ( as in funny) you actually are, i would love to meet you. I knew you were frustrated beyond belief.

I hope you didn't spit on your husband too much.................vision of a dripping man turning up at the agents................but yes, use the weapons at your disposal.

Actually I feel personally involved in this "mission" now, you've made it so real and I admire the fact that you still have your sense of humour and your sanity..................this is going to make a great BBQ story one day..................when the scars have healed............lol.

Fingers crossed that your secret weapon works.

Funny, but I usually communicate with men better too and hubby with women, so this sounds like a plan, and I think you have hit the nail on the head by sending him out solo...........sans children...........I do know of cases where women with children, particularly single women have been discriminated against in getting rentals in comparison to let's say, a career couple...................wrong but does happen.

May the shiny, saliva encrusted, secret weapon return victorious.............

[DXB2OZ]

I must confess that at one stage during our lives, we moved to the UK. Despite knowing that we would be going to a MUCH smaller house, my "sorting" and "decluttering" were abysmal. I flatly refused to throw out things like the kids old art works (despite the fact that nobody else cared) and ended up shuffling a mountain of c**p back and forth across the globe. But in a time of uncertainty, it gave me something to cling to and I clung.

Truth be told, 9 months later, work shifted us again across the globe and I ended up ruthlessly tossing out all those things which I had refused to even contemplate getting rid of in the first place.

It is sometimes you difficult, when you don't even know if your world is flat or round anymore, to be able to see straight and think clearly. I truly hope you find a great home soon, so you can start to regroup, settle down and be able to enjoy your new lives.

[Nev]

My wife and sold everything except for 3x cardboard 75cm x 75cm x 50cm boxes of stuff which we air freighted, took a while to get back up and running on this side but it worked for us, got rid of everything except the really important stuff

[DXB2OZ]

My problem was a complete lack of clear thinking on important stuff. Couldn't choose, so decided it was all critical!! As a result spent several months barely being able to move in a tiny UK house before having a massive clear out. After that, the house was actually quite nice - more cosy than cramped.

Am trying soooo hard not to make that mistake again. I really admire your willpower.