IELTS and "Appostille"

[W+R]

1) I phoned the British Council in South Africa today and they said they cannot book a date for the general IELTS for me because all their known test dates in johannesburg are fully booked, end of story. They only have space available for the academic IELTS. They say that for the general IELTS I would have to wait untill next year. My question is this: If i write the academic IELTS would that then definitely be good enough in cases where only a general IELTS result is required? I am an electrical engineer applying for a 136 visa from south africa.

2) Has anybody written the academic IELTS and do you think it is much more difficult than the general one?

3) Regarding certification of documents. I was told by a lawyer who often works with immigration applications that documents often need to be certified for international recognition by obtaining an "apostille". I see on internet that this is the way countries recognise each other's certification if they are part of the Hague convention. (Both SA and Australia are part of this) Has anybody come across this requirement? I have allready sent away my application for assessment of my qualifications without an apostille....

Any feedback or advice would be greatly appreciated!

Thanks

Werner

[Springbok]

1) My question is this: If i write the academic IELTS would that then definitely be good enough in cases where only a general IELTS result is required?

3) Regarding certification of documents. I was told by a lawyer who often works with immigration applications that documents often need to be certified for international recognition by obtaining an "apostille".

Hi Werner

The IELTS (General) test was the biggest waste of time I've had the misfortune to endure in my entire life! Scored 90% and my home language is Afrikaans. Not sure how much different the Academic test is from the General test, but I'm sure it would also be valid for your purposes.

As for certification, I had all my documents certified as true copies of the originals by either lawyers or chartered accountants. No need for the "apostille". And then for things like degrees or birth certificates which are only available in Afrikaans, you have to get them translated into English by an official translator. You cannot do the translation yourself.

Cheers

Charl

[The Parsons Family]

Hey there,

My wife being a teacher sat the academic test, she said it was difficult but still scored the highest possible

Either way I know it is of a higher standard but as you are an engineer i'm pretty sure you will manage, and if you pass the "better" test done all the better for you I guess.

My Brother is a civil engineer and it took him all of 1 week to get his qualifications accessed, apparently their is a Washington accord that SA and Australia are member of (if that is the correct term )

so you should be perfectly fine!!

[JJV]

If i write the academic IELTS would that then definitely be good enough in cases where only a general IELTS result is required?

Considering that the Academic one has a higher standing than the General Training one you are safe on this issue.

Judged by the specimen material the two only differ on the reading and writing parts of the paper. Seems to require a bit more of interpretation and reasoning capabilities.

[Guest Sunshine Sister]

3) Regarding certification of documents. I was told by a lawyer who often works with immigration applications that documents often need to be certified for international recognition by obtaining an "apostille". I see on internet that this is the way countries recognise each other's certification if they are part of the Hague convention. (Both SA and Australia are part of this) Has anybody come across this requirement?

Hey there Werner,

I am familiar with the apostille as we had to have it done for our birth and wedding certificate when we moved to the Netherlands. In Holland neither of these are accepted without the apostille. It was not needed for Australia (even though we still have it) when we put our applications in 5 months ago. Exactly as Springbok said, we took copies of our certificates, diplomas, etc in to the Embassy in Seoul and they stamped and signed all of them for us as copies of the original. It obviously worked, as I am writing this from Sydney !!

Good luck, hope all works out well.

Love

SS

[Pippa]

1) I phoned the British Council in South Africa today and they said they cannot book a date for the general IELTS for me because all their known test dates in johannesburg are fully booked, end of story. They only have space available for the academic IELTS. They say that for the general IELTS I would have to wait untill next year. My question is this: If i write the academic IELTS would that then definitely be good enough in cases where only a general IELTS result is required? I am an electrical engineer applying for a 136 visa from south africa.

2) Has anybody written the academic IELTS and do you think it is much more difficult than the general one?

Hi Werner and Renee,

I did not experience IELTS the way Springbok did, but then again I know that I am not very strong in languages. According to my knowledge one have to score 6 out of 9 for all disciplines namely “listening”, “writing”, “speaking” and “reading" and then one get an overall band score, which is an average of you scores in the different disciplines.

I honestly did not find it as easy, and I would not have been surprised if I scored 2 out of 9! Fortunately, I passed with an Overall Band Score of 7.5 out of 9, but as I said it was not that easy.

It therefore obviously depend on you English abilities. My sister again, is very strong in languages and she will easily pass the IELTS and that with confidence!!!

3) Regarding certification of documents. I was told by a lawyer who often works with immigration applications that documents often need to be certified for international recognition by obtaining an "apostille". I see on internet that this is the way countries recognise each other's certification if they are part of the Hague convention. (Both SA and Australia are part of this) Has anybody come across this requirement? I have allready sent away my application for assessment of my qualifications without an apostille....

You can go to the South African Translators’ Institute’s website to find a list of registered official translators. We made use of Dilicom for translation purposes and they gave us excellent service. I will however first ask the relevant Institutions whether your degrees / diplomas are available in English. Although both my husband and I studied in Afrikaans, they issued us with English copies of our degrees and academic transcripts.

If you need to claim the 5 bonus point for Afrikaans, the University can also furnish you with a letter confirming that your course was presented in Afrikaans.

Good luck!

Pippa

[W+R]

Thank you very much to all of you! I have decided to do the academic test. I have paid allready and they have confirmed that I am writing on the 25'th of November 2006. Wish me luck, I hope I am not biting off more than I can chew.....

[chatterbug]

Hey Werner,

I don't think those tests are inherently as difficult as the situation you end up doing them in. The examinations are really school style and the officials I found to be quite .....well official! Bearing in mind they are examinations that are interpreted against norm groups, throughout the english world - so one would expect standardised administration instructions.

But face it - one often goes into those examinations - knowing full well that the future of your whole family depends on you passing this test (well that's sort of what goes through ones mind). And as you have mentioned they can be quite Nazi with their booking dates etc etc. So here you have someone who's "life", as it were, depends on a good result dealing with often dispassionate test administrators who couldn't give a hoot really! Its even worse if you are Afrikaans speaking for e.g. and you hear you have to do this international, University of Cambridge developed test and you will be compared with the likes of the rest of the english speaking world, with the poms included.

Because of these factors I must say I was pretty stressed going into the exam. Also you need to be pretty swithced on because they only go through the instructions for the exercises once and if you miss it you could easily bomb out, and you'd have to come back for a retest. Now in normal circumstances it would not be too much of an issue but many people only have one chance in reality because the future bookings for test days can be quite a mission and many people have job offers on this side or have some other sort of time dependent commitment.

It all turned out well for me in the and I must say I did much better than I thought I did after leaving the examination room. I found the speaking part a treat and only then did I start relaxing! I was quite surprised at the result and only then realised that it is quite an easy test.

The point I am making is that although you shouldn't underestimate the test and the "cost of failure" factors that will inevitably be at work, the actual test (if you could strip away all of these other factors) is not that difficult. If you speak English regularly in a professional capacity you'd have no problems.

Hope this helps

Cambridge English windgat BUG

[chatterbug]

Jinne Werner

Enigste iets wat ek weet van daai fensie woord Appostille is dat dit heel bybels klink, dalk iets te doen met die 12 Appostille in Kaapstad? of the great ocean road naby Melbourne?

Of 'n geaffekteer Pta aksent soos in: "hey boetie ek will ook 'n (fruit) (Ok komaan werk met my! onthou daai lekker taai sweeties met die suikertjies om) Pastille he! Sien "appostille" = "'n pastille he"

OK OK ek weet dis laat; ek is op die "spook wag" besig om na baba bug se monitor te luister, miskien moet ek eerder gaan slapies..........of 'n nappy change!

ek sal weer normaal in die oggend wees...dink ek?hoop ek!

Edited October 19, 2006 by chatterbug

[Pippa]

Hi Werner,

You can do it! All the best for the Academic IELTS tests!

Pippa

[Springbok]

I thought you guys might find this of interest, regarding the IELTS test. Hitchcocks and other interested parties are challenging at every opportunity. The letter was written by Cecil Bass from Hitchcocks, to Peter Speldewinde, Director of Skilled Migration, at DIMIA.

Regards

Charl

Dear Peter

I attended the Migration Institute Annual Conference in Sydney week before last and I enjoyed your presentation. Your dealt with the success of skilled migrants in finding employment and in particular how this correlates to their English skills ability. I would like to raise the English language testing requirements recently introduced by ASPC for all applicants from certain countries.

DIMIA's recent decision to test all applicants unless they are a native English speaker and hold a passport of the USA, Canada, New Zealand or the UK, would seem to be unfair to applicants form several other countries. Our particular interest is in respect of applicants from South Africa and Zimbabwe who are applying fro 136,138, 139 and SIR visas.

I find this and its current application could be seen to be a case of overkill. Many South Africans and Zimbabweans are native English speakers and have never spoken any language other than English in their homes, educational institutions and workplaces. A South African graduate form a University that teaches in English will have excellent English and it is a disincentive for these applicants to have to do IELTS testing and could even be considered insulting. I am such a graduate and my English skills, I would humbly suggest, are adequate for my professional needs in Australia.

English is the "lingua franca" of South Africa and people who have completed secondary and tertiary education with English as the medium of instruction should not, in this firm's view, be required to do IELTS testing as they will generally have excellent English skills. Even those who have only completed secondary school, where English is the medium of instruction, would in almost all cases be well equipped to cope in Australia. If the applicant was schooled in another language or graduated from a University where the medium of instruction was Afrikaans or a language other than English, then it would be reasonable to ask them to have their English skills assessed. Our firm has been working with South African clients for almost 20 years and have found their English to generally be excellent. We visit the country five to six times a year and have three South African staff. I have just returned from a consulting trip there and there was considerable disappointment amongst clients and prospective clients when we advised them of this new requirement. In addition to the frustration it causes, it delays applications and adds significant costs.

We would suggest that this decision be reviewed to include South African and Zimbabwean passport holders in the list as soon as possible as we believe it is hindering the flow of high quality skilled migrants to Australia. The assessing officer would still retain the right to request IELTS testing should there be any doubt as to the applicant's English speaking ability.

Kind regards

Cecil Bass B. Acc C.A. (S.A.)

Registered Migration Agent# 0004497

Managing Director

Hitchcock & Associates

Level 3, 815 Pacific Highway

Chatswood, NSW, 2057

Sydney, Australia

Telephone +61-2-8440-8300

Fax +61-2-8440-8333

visit our website www.hitchcock.com.au

[Dolfyntjie]

I thought you guys might find this of interest, regarding the IELTS test. Hitchcocks and other interested parties are challenging at every opportunity. The letter was written by Cecil Bass from Hitchcocks, to Peter Speldewinde, Director of Skilled Migration, at DIMIA.

Regards

Charl

Dear Peter

I attended the Migration Institute Annual Conference in Sydney week before last and I enjoyed your presentation. Your dealt with the success of skilled migrants in finding employment and in particular how this correlates to their English skills ability. I would like to raise the English language testing requirements recently introduced by ASPC for all applicants from certain countries.

DIMIA's recent decision to test all applicants unless they are a native English speaker and hold a passport of the USA, Canada, New Zealand or the UK, would seem to be unfair to applicants form several other countries. Our particular interest is in respect of applicants from South Africa and Zimbabwe who are applying fro 136,138, 139 and SIR visas.

I find this and its current application could be seen to be a case of overkill. Many South Africans and Zimbabweans are native English speakers and have never spoken any language other than English in their homes, educational institutions and workplaces. A South African graduate form a University that teaches in English will have excellent English and it is a disincentive for these applicants to have to do IELTS testing and could even be considered insulting. I am such a graduate and my English skills, I would humbly suggest, are adequate for my professional needs in Australia.

English is the "lingua franca" of South Africa and people who have completed secondary and tertiary education with English as the medium of instruction should not, in this firm's view, be required to do IELTS testing as they will generally have excellent English skills. Even those who have only completed secondary school, where English is the medium of instruction, would in almost all cases be well equipped to cope in Australia. If the applicant was schooled in another language or graduated from a University where the medium of instruction was Afrikaans or a language other than English, then it would be reasonable to ask them to have their English skills assessed. Our firm has been working with South African clients for almost 20 years and have found their English to generally be excellent. We visit the country five to six times a year and have three South African staff. I have just returned from a consulting trip there and there was considerable disappointment amongst clients and prospective clients when we advised them of this new requirement. In addition to the frustration it causes, it delays applications and adds significant costs.

We would suggest that this decision be reviewed to include South African and Zimbabwean passport holders in the list as soon as possible as we believe it is hindering the flow of high quality skilled migrants to Australia. The assessing officer would still retain the right to request IELTS testing should there be any doubt as to the applicant's English speaking ability.

Kind regards

Cecil Bass B. Acc C.A. (S.A.)

Registered Migration Agent# 0004497

Managing Director

Hitchcock & Associates

Level 3, 815 Pacific Highway

Chatswood, NSW, 2057

Sydney, Australia

Telephone +61-2-8440-8300

Fax +61-2-8440-8333

visit our website www.hitchcock.com.au

Hi Springbok

Do you know if there is any progress on this topic? This will save us a lot of money and time.

[Springbok]

Hi Springbok

Do you know if there is any progress on this topic? This will save us a lot of money and time.

Not as far as I know, but you're welcome to contact Hitchcock & Associates and ask them what progress (if any) they've made. You'll get their phone number in Pretoria on their website.

[Gizmo]

Hi there Werner.

Yes, you can write the academic in place of the general - the academic is more difficult.

Both my husband and I wrote the academic exams. Neither of us brought any of the perparations booklets, or did any preparation at all.

Two sections of the Academic (listening and oral), are the same as the General. The other two (reading and writing) are quite a bit more difficult. I will write some tips for you this evening and post them.

Oh - just saw the date... oops - ignore my post.

Edited January 28, 2008 by Gizmo