Confused Saffa.

[Marcello]

Ladies & Gentlemen.

A very hearty hello to all, from a very newbie who is still living in our homeland!!

What a wonderful forum that I stumbled across with even better contributors. After lurking around for quite sometime I thought it better post some questions that have been giving me sleepness nights.

Firstly let me give you a little backround, so please bear with me! I am 35yrs old my wife is 32 we have 2 little ones aged 6 months and 3 years, We live very comfortably here in Sa great house which is paid off both drive Suv's our son is in private school, family holiday home etc etc... My wife is a speech pathologist and I'm a business owner. Now comes the BIG question, should we move?? I know that is a very difficult question and I'm under no illusion there will be some serious sacrifices. But it bothers both of us tremendously. And we would be giving up quite a lot as mentioned above.

I have another question for the pro's out there, Being a business owner here in Sa with no qualifications I am concerned I will not find work! Does being a business owner here carry any weight over there, could I perhaps start a business or buy a business?

(I'm in the retail textile industry with 4 stores and employ +- 50 employees)

As you can see I'm in very difficult position and really just don't know at this point.

Any thought would be greatly appreciated.

Thanking you in advance.

Marcello

[Bronwyn&Co]

Hi Marcello & welcome to the forum

We came here almost 8 years ago on a business visa. Do you intend to do the same or do you perhaps qualify for a skilled visa?

Your decision isn't an easy one. We were in a similar position.

Can you see yourself working for a boss again?

Can you leave the business to run under management?

So many questions instead of answers, sorry

Edited July 26, 2014 by Bronwyn&Co

[Marcello]

Thank you Bronwyn for your prompt reply.

To answer your questions.

I would love to do the same and don't mind starting from scratch again, but I am not familiar with the Australinan markets

I would also need to do some serious due diligence before I embark on that project.

Working for a boss would not be impossible, but will be difficult. I have worked for myself since I have left school !!

I leave the business for a weekend and there is caos on Monday when I return, I work 7 days a week non stop. 7 to 7 sometimes later,

I am a very hands on person. And not very good at delegating when I can do it properly myself.

Regards

[Sunnyskies]

Marcello

If you could build a business in SA you can build a business here. If you know how to connect with people you will connect with people here.

The big thing to remember is that while you have the skills and know what you are doing it takes a while to build connections and do you have the patience to rebuild what you already have. That for me has been the most frustrating thing about the move. If you are gregarious and connect with people easily it will be easier. Use your sport to connect you will be amazed at the surfing community.

[miran]

You desperately need a LSD. We weren't sure either but the trip gave us peace of mind about our decision. I visited some schools and my husband went to printing companies to see how things worked there.

Good luck! To make the decision and be 100% sure when you haven't been targets of crime or other injustice is really difficult.....

[Bronwyn&Co]

Hi Marcello

I'm definitely not trying to put you off but I wish I'd known some of the stuff I know now, back when we came over. Our SA business is also 50 employees with 4 branches, and so your post resonates with me. There are very few business people on here (a few in Aus, not many in SA at all. I can think of one, but she is being sponsored over). The ones I knew personally, I'd say 70% went back as soon as they got passports.

A lot does depend on your Visa type because if you come on a skilled visa (your wife's skill maybe? I don't know), that will leave you free to start a new business. If you come on the Business Visa you will be obliged to start a business, you have no choice.

The thing with the Business Visa is that it is a temporary visa. If you are successful in your Australian business you will get PR but you're looking at 2-3 years minimum. It took us 4.

You don't qualify for any childcate rebates or government medical (Medicare).Your older child will be in school soon enough but your baby will have to go to childcare if your wife works and you are starting a business. That's about $25k per year for baby. For the older one, we have loooong school holidays here, so aftercare will be a similar price. December holidays are 6 weeks long...your best option might be an au pair, around $300 per week I believe.

As for medical, take a look online at Visitor's Cover through places like Bupa and Medibank. I think you're looking at close to $500 per month, or $6k pa.

So you need about $60k a year before you've even started living, on the Business Visa (can you tell I'm still annoyed over 7 years later? Haha). What I'm trying to say is on a Business Visa you need deep pockets. On a Skilled Visa you can get job(s) and maybe start something on the side to build up.

Are you prepared to be a stay at home dad while your wife works? We did that for the first year and it was a fantastic experience for my husband and the kids. There are a huge number of families here that do it, btw.

If you are fortunate enough to come on the Investor Visa that's great, but it ties your capital up so you can't use it in a new business. However you are free to do what you want and you get the interest. It's extremely expensive in ZAR, unfortunately.

I guess you've thought about your SA business. We left ours running under management. My husband went down to 3 days a week while we did the Visa (to see how they would do), incentivised them over the years, and now run things very little by Skype. The negative was that we didn't have a lot of capital to bring but the positive is that we still live on the income. Also, our kids were 9 & 11 and I immediately got a job which paid a good salary while my husband looked at options.

It's good that you like to work hard, a lot of businesses here need that due to the expense of staff. If you decide to buy a business I don't recommend a franchise

Definitely agree that an LSD will help you guys. In fact it's a necessity if you haven't been here before.

I'm really not trying to put you off. I think you're doing the right thing (yes I do!) but your set of challenges is very different to the norm. You may have other options I'm not aware of or parents who can come and help for extended periods etc.

You will experience a massive change in lifestyle which may be a shock, but with it will come a reduction in stress levels and that all-important feeling of safety. Your boundaries and expectations will be pushed beyond what you imagined. It all depends on your personality whether you'll like that.

PS. Sorry for the info bombardment!!

Edited July 26, 2014 by Bronwyn&Co

[rozellem]

Hi there. I think your first port of call should be a reputable immigration agent, who can talk you through your visa options. People on here rave about Migrate2oz (guy called Reuben) and Stephen Dickson from Migrations Outcome Australia. Beware, many sharks around. Stephen is a member of this forum, so you could message him. Normally the initial chat is free, so no obligation to go with them. You can also buy part of their services and do some of it yourself. They will steer you in the right direction and choose the most flexible visa for your situation. Choosing the right visa is vital. I am no expert, but from being around a while, I would go with your wifes qualifications. It does look like speech pathologist is on the SOL list below. She will have to have her qualifications and experience verified by the appropriate bodies, but it might be your better option. If she is the main applicant, you the husband/partner, can pretty much do what you want. Priceless.

Its a bit of a mind shift, living outside of RSA. When we go back to visit, its a bit like seeing an ex again, thinking to yourself, what did I see in that person! You can sort of see that there were good times, but good grief, you cant imagine living like that again. I end up feeling sorry for my friends in their big houses, driving their Evogues, having issues with nannies and staff, competing with one another and trying to out do the Joneses. You cant see it when you live there, but it is a very warped way of living. Good on you for looking into the future and keeping the options open for your children.

http://www.immi.gov.au/Work/Pages/skilled-occupations-lists/sol.aspx

[Marcello]

Thank you everybody for the comments, much appreciated.

Bronwyn please don't apologize the more info the better for us.

We would more than likely go in with my wife's work, so skills visa it is. If we go in on a skills visa does the state pay for schooling and medical?

And are the state schools on a par with our private schools? (our son is at a Jewish private school)

A LSD holiday is imperative at this point and we have planned it for next year June school holidays for 2 weeks.

Thanks again all.

[KalahariHarry]

Welcome marcello, nice having you here. T

[Bronwyn&Co]

Hey Marcello I don't know about all states as we've only lived in QLD & Adelaide, but state schools are basically free on a temp visa, in both.

I don't know a lot about the skilled visa so someone else will have to confirm, but I believe you qualify for Medicare with PR (permanent residency) but not with a temp visa. So it will depend on which skilled visa you go for.

Edited July 28, 2014 by Bronwyn&Co

[Classicman]

Hi Marcello

I'm in a similar boat to you (and in the same harbor it seems). We have just done our LSD trip and are committing to moving over in January. I have a 190SS Visa for ACT and we are headed for Canberra. I am going against the grain and good advice from many on this forum and looking to buy a business. I am busy with the due diligence as we speak and I hope to make an offer in the next week or so.

Australia, like anywhere, is what you make of it. Running a business in PE is very different to running a business in Jhb, but that doesn't mean you won't be able to adapt and be successful in Jhb. Likewise in Australia - at least, that is my philosophy.

I'm giving it a go and I know that I will be successful. It might take a little longer than anticipated, but so what. I get to choose what I want to do and don't have to take three steps back in a job. To me, that is worth the sacrifice and risk.

[liesl7]

Hi Classicman

We are moving to Oz on a SC188 (business visa) in December. Have been looking for a business since our visa was granted in March. How did you manage to find a business while still in South Africa? We have been warned against doing that, but I am just curious how you managed to find something.

[TeeTMI]

Purely from the visa point of view: If your wife can make the points and skills assessment requirements for a skilled independent visa that would provide a permanent residence visa and may be preferable to the business visa option. Speech Pathologist is on the SOL and just from your overview at the top it is likely your wife would score reasonably well points wise.

www.taylormadeimmigration.com/PointsCalculator (or skillselect on the DIBP web site)

[Classicman]

Hi Classicman

We are moving to Oz on a SC188 (business visa) in December. Have been looking for a business since our visa was granted in March. How did you manage to find a business while still in South Africa? We have been warned against doing that, but I am just curious how you managed to find something.

I researched businesses online and viewed many on business broker sites. I narrowed it down to one that interested me and called for all the relevant information while I was still here. The financials looked OK and we visited the business on our LSD trip, met with the owners and went through questions that I had on their business. Now that we are back in SA, I have a very good idea of the business and its capabilities. I had more questions and have called for the last 5 years tax returns, copies of bank statements etc.

By the time I am ready to make an offer, I am pretty sure that I will have covered all bases.

[Marcello]

Hi Classicman.

Thank you for your input.

Since you are in PE would it be possible for us to meet, what you are planning is exactly what I have in mind.

Could I steal you away for lunch or coffee sometime, my treat!!

Even if it's for a chat over the phone.

Please pm me your mobile number.

Regards

M

As the saying goes it's all about networking!!

[Bronwyn&Co]

I researched businesses online and viewed many on business broker sites. I narrowed it down to one that interested me and called for all the relevant information while I was still here. The financials looked OK and we visited the business on our LSD trip, met with the owners and went through questions that I had on their business. Now that we are back in SA, I have a very good idea of the business and its capabilities. I had more questions and have called for the last 5 years tax returns, copies of bank statements etc.

By the time I am ready to make an offer, I am pretty sure that I will have covered all bases.

Just bear in mind that Australian Pty Ltds are not required to have their financials audited, as they are in South Africa.

[Bronwyn&Co]

'Its a bit of a mind shift, living outside of RSA. When we go back to visit, its a bit like seeing an ex again, thinking to yourself, what did I see in that person! You can sort of see that there were good times, but good grief, you cant imagine living like that again'

I just love Rozellem's quote here. Such a great analogy.

Edited July 28, 2014 by Bronwyn&Co

[Classicman]

Just bear in mind that Australian Pty Ltds are not required to have their financials audited, as they are in South Africa.

Thanks, I am aware of that.

[Leonvn]

Hi marcello

The BIG question -should you move? That is something only you can decide.

Like you we've owned a few businesses (spurs) and up to 300 employees. We sold our property and businesses,said goodbye to everyone and got on a plane and landed in Brisbane. We did'nt know anybody here ,stayed in a resort for 2 weeks ,found and rented a house and 2 months later bought a business and carried on working for myself but before you do anything you must first choose.

I've basically never work for a boss and would find that difficult that's why I bought a existing business

Your second question if being a business owner carries any weight ? If you've always work for yourself who is going to recommend you- You- soos hulle se, jakkels prys sy eie stert! But that does not mean you can't find a job. Whatever you decide go for it 100%!

Take care.

[Marcello]

Hi Leonvn.

Thank you for you reply, my wife will be applying for a skills visa and I will go as her spouse, It looks like we will be in Western Australia (Perth). How are you finding having your own business over there? trading conditions etc. Can I be forward in asking what line of industry are you in? Our LSD trip is booked for next year June.

Thank you once again.

Marcello

[Leonvn]

Hi Marcello

We used to own a few spur steak ranches and stones pool bar in Knysna & Cpt . So when we moved here I thought we should stick to what we know and stay in the hospitality industry,but it is not the same as back in SA! Anyway we sold our coffee shop in Brisbane and bought a Management Right's business. We manage property in a complex , 72 town houses for investors and duties for the body corp, real estate agent. If you are considering buying a business look into little or low labour as that is a huge factor here in oz something we didn't pay enough attention to.It's not funny when your employees earns more than you! But with the proper financial advise one can live pretty well here - expensive or not ,even after having to do all the housework yourself. Happy to answer any questions you may have